Early in 2006, on the eve of their departure to Guam to serve as Neocatechumenal missionaries, Enrico and Francesca Da Ponte were interviewed by Francesca Bellemo, a reporter for the Venetian Catholic website “Gente Veneta.it”.
When Bellemo asked, “What challenges await you?”, Enrico replied...Read more.
When Bellemo asked, “What challenges await you?”, Enrico replied...Read more.
Arrogant and Judgemental!
ReplyDeleteSo they refer to us as as "people who adhere only outwardly to the Christian message and then in everyday life do not behave in a way adhering to their beliefs."
REALLY? But it is OK for them (missionaries) to mouch off of these "Christians" who have been unknowingly contributing to the finances of the NCW who used these funds to bring them to Guam, pay their rent, utilities and heavens knows what other expenses!
What a shame! With such attitude it is impossible not yet to evangelize, but at least to be "civilized" and living as simple humans anywhere around the world. Absolute arrogance.
ReplyDeleteno doubt they were relying on intel from neocats who were already on island--ie, pius. and with the blessing of apuron.
ReplyDeleteNormally, Pius will ask for x number of families in mission. Kiko draws the lottery and off they come.
DeleteThis Enrico is the guy standing at the door of the seminary along with Preston who blocked the entry of the ladies of the LFM.
ReplyDeleteThat family has been on "mission" for over ten years now. How many 90 day visas is that . . . ?
DeleteUnfortunately, I can see some truth in Enrico's observations. For example, how many of us really really know the true meaning of each step/phase of the Holy Mass? Those who would disagree with me are probably the few who really do know and think they are part of the majority, or the many who only think they know. I ask everyone to give themselves an agonizing reappraisal of what they really know about the Holy Mass before reacting to my comments. Then let the conversation begin!
ReplyDeleteWhy should we care about a neocat missionary's appraisal of what we know when he subscribes to a religion that teaches Jesus Christ is a sinner?
DeleteWhat we need is not some damn "missionaries" filled with Kiko's Kaka, we need a real bishop who will actually teach and exemplify Christ. I think we're getting one.
Anon @ 5:38 AM - Enrico's comment - "The island is civilized – says Francesca – and lives many contradictions: a great outward adherence to the worship is not accompanied by an authentic faith. And it is a country that does not live, as is the case here [Italy], secularization: the churches are still full of people, but these are people who adhere only outwardly to the Christian message and then in everyday life do not behave in a way adhering to their beliefs. Our task is also to give witness to that of the Christian family model that the Lord has called us to live.”
DeleteMissionary - A person sent on a religious mission, especially one sent to promote Christianity in a foreign country. Guam is not a foreign country but a territory of the United States of America. These missionaries came from a foreign country to a territory of the USoA.
Thank You for saying my Island is Civilized! How do you know how I live my life! I believe in my Catholic teachings and live my Catholic teachings. How dare they come to Guam and think that they are going to give us lessons in our faith when one of them cannot even speak English?
Is closing the door of the RMS to Catholics on Guam who have paid for teaching us living in God's Will!
yes... let the conversation begin... Alex, Order of Mass for $500.
Delete"how many of us really really know the true meaning of each step/phase of the Holy Mass"...
In Holy Communion, we receive the Body of Christ standing up.
We do not consume His Body immediately.
We are to hold His Body in our hands close to our hearts with adoration.
After everyone has received the Body of Christ, the priest proceeds with "Behold, the Body of Christ......"
And we respond with "Lord, I am not worthy to receive you......" All the words are the same as it is in the regular Mass.
But we consume the Body of Christ together with the priest.
And yes, we consume His Body sitting down.
http://neocatechemunal.blogspot.com/2016/09/ncw-devotion-to-our-blessed-mother-mary.html
DianaSeptember 8, 2016 at 6:13 PM
Anon @5:38, First of all Enrico is forming his opinion before he is sent here, which is Chuck's point, he appears to be prejudging. Second he sees the outward appearance, Jesus tells us not to rely on the outward appearance, but rather what is in the heart which no one but God alone can judge. Third, It is not the steps of the mass that we need to be intimate with, but the substance of what Lord is offering us in this Sacrament, to enter into a communion with us in the most intimate way. It is a knowledge that one cannot fully understand by intellectual ascent, but through faith given to us by God himself, and which is more certain than all human knowledge combined, simply because its source is God himself. It is enough for us to understand that since this falls in the realm of faith, we need to rely on what the Church teaches, because it is the pillar and foundation of truth, and not what some person interprets or perceives what the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass or the Holy Eucharist is. The Church teaches us it is the pinnacle of our faith, it is the greatest treasure of the Church, The summit of the Church's liturgy, the greatest prayer we can offer to God, It is God himself. God has revealed this to us through the Church, what other Good News will the NCW reveal to us?
Delete5.38 a.m, it has begun! You don't learn these things in the NCW - no matter where else you don't learn them either. And you don't learn good boundaries in the NCW, which is what Christ is all about. I bet I've been in the Way longer than you!
DeleteMembers of the Jesuit Volunteer Corps, lay men and women who work at Jesuit apostolates around the world, have the right idea when they say that their work "ruins them for life." What they mean, of course, is that significant aspects of their own worldview will be challenged and changed (for the good) through their collaboration with the people they serve.
ReplyDeleteI suspect that this might be what Archbishop Byrnes means when he says that he will come and "listen." He'll undoubtedly perceive our needs, but not without recognizing the presence of Christ already here.
"I suspect that this might be what Archbishop Byrnes means when he says that he will come and "listen." He'll undoubtedly perceive our needs, but not without recognizing the presence of Christ already here." WELL SAID.
DeleteAnd the presence of Satan. But then Pius and Apuron will probably still be off island.
DeleteThanks to our small but growing movement of imperfect but true Catholics, we see the NCW for what it is.
ReplyDeletePeter 2
3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction.
3:17 You therefore, brethren, knowing these things before, take heed, lest being led aside by the error of the unwise, you fall from your own steadfastness.
3:18 But grow in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and unto the day of eternity, Amen.
Eusebio strikes again and publishes his absolutely false narrative for the WWW to read. What is wrong with him? Let's pray for Archbishop Byrnes. He cannot realize what awaits him. Evil? Yes.
ReplyDeleteWould it be judgmental if I said "Anchor babies?"
ReplyDeleteThe NCW use the Popes' call for evangelization as a guise to form their own communities not spread the Church. It is the classic bait and switch. You are drawn into going and listening because they assert a relationship with the Church however after you are "born" into a new community the truth comes out about how the mechanics of the communities work. And it's only AFTER. You cannot get a preview. You cannot ask further questions before you are born into a community.
ReplyDeleteAfter that first convivence for some it is far too late to say no because you are asked if you want to be in this new community and the responsibles say that your "yes' goes to Heaven. You are being witnessed by the Bishop and if not a bishop then a whole row of priests. And that kind of makes you want to say "yes".
Your first weekend after that convivence you join the main communities and you are welcomed with a standing ovation and there is a agape, a party, after the Eucharist. All of these are fatal hooks that keep people in the communities. After that the passage of time and intertia keeps you in.
For some brothers being in these communities helps them vocalize their issues, dealing with it with peers,
when these brothers actually find a resolution to their issue, it is imprinted in them that the communities are a help to their lives forever. The communities continue to pray for Apuron and the reason Pius requests that they do is because without Apuron the way wouldnt be here, but so what?-Not withstanding Apurons allegations of child sexual abuse, these two men have cast this Archdiocese into a great divide.
Yes Jose you would be judgmental! What the hell is and "Anchor Baby"? BTW, I don't mean to brag, but I am fluent in three languages, English, Chamorro and Profanity. I want to use one my languages but Tim might not publish my response to that SOB and his f----- fake mission. I used to be a civilized person until I found out how much the Neos do not "outwardly" live their Christian lives, like Apuron, Pius, Eusebio and every other Neo on Guam. The new picket sign needs to read "Moratorium on the NCW". See you Sunday.
ReplyDeleteYou're rad Joe.
ReplyDeleteDear Charles White, Tim Rohr and whoever might have felt hurt by the statement I made in 2006 when we were interviewed in Venice before coming to the mission.
ReplyDeleteI heartily apologize if you felt judged by my words, this wasn’t my intention since I don’t know you personally and I’m sure that your faith is much greater than mine.
I know I don’t have faith , I see it every day. I simply don’t have it but I’ve found a place in the Church where I can receive the faith I lack, to endure the struggling I encounter daily, in my marriage, in raising our children etc.. I’m a witness that there is an “intensive care unit” in the Church where the weak people like me can receive help, through the sacraments, listening to the Word of God weekly and having a Christian community of brothers and sisters who also receive the help they need to live their Christian life, a place where I can listen to the preaching of the kerigma that is simply a life saver for me.
This is not a club for the best ones, on the contrary, it is a place for the “sick”. In these eleven years in mission here in Guam I’ve met many people with a strong and deep faith who have edified me and made me desire, one day, to have it myself. However I’ve also met many people who suffer a lot in their lives, some who have lost their faith or the meaning of their lives, who have a broken marriage, or an addiction to gambling, pornography, drugs or alcohol that keeps them enslaved, youth, and even children, who have no hope and are contemplating suicide. For these people I am a witness that to have a Christian marriage it’s possible despite my weakness, my sins and my lack of faith. In these years I’ve seen people helped by our testimony and now their lives are different. This is an encouragement for me to continue.
Again, I don’t feel like a healthy person who gives others advises on how to live a healthy life but a sick person who has found a cure for her “cancer”, someone out there may benefit from it.
My apologies for the generalization and for my arrogance
Happy Thanksgiving
Francesca
Aside from the fact that these are all neo cliches, the question is what the hell are you doing posing as "missionaries?" And more so, what the hell are you doing living off our diocese? Pack now.
DeleteDear Francesca,
DeleteThank you for your post, I hope you also realise that the "many people who suffer a lot in their lives, some who have lost their faith or the meaning of their lives, who have a broken marriage, or an addiction to gambling, pornography, drugs or alcohol that keeps them enslaved, youth, and even children, who have no hope and are contemplating suicide" have within the Catholic church many other communities (non Neocat) that are able to help them find their way back to God.
These authentic Catholic communities will give them the life-giving light of faith proclaimed in the Catechism of the Catholic Church and just not move them from one type on enslavement, to another enslavement, by becoming a cult member of a group that brings bears no relation to the true Catholic faith.
I hope and pray that this Advent you and your family begin realise how that you are mere pawns to building the kingdom of Kiko instead of building the Kingdom of God. May your eyes be opened and so that you see clearly and not let your minds were blinded like the Israelites that Paul laments about in his letter to the Romans (Romans 11:8-10).
Peace
Your true Catholic family.
Dear Francesca,
DeleteThank you for your post, I hope you also realise that the "many people who suffer a lot in their lives, some who have lost their faith or the meaning of their lives, who have a broken marriage, or an addiction to gambling, pornography, drugs or alcohol that keeps them enslaved, youth, and even children, who have no hope and are contemplating suicide" have within the Catholic church many other communities (non Neocat) that are able to help them find their way back to God.
These authentic Catholic communities will give them the life-giving light of faith proclaimed in the Catechism of the Catholic Church and just not move them from one type of enslavement, to another enslavement, by becoming a cult member of a group that brings bears no relation to the true Catholic faith.
I hope and pray that this Advent you and your family begin realise how that you are mere pawns to building the kingdom of Kiko instead of building the Kingdom of God. May your eyes be opened and so that you see clearly and not let your minds were blinded like the Israelites that Paul laments about in his letter to the Romans (Romans 11:8-10).
Peace
Your true Catholic family.
Francesca, Happy Thanksgiving season. It's true that in the UK, since the sinking of the four good chapters of "Easter People" the NCW walked into a vacuum. The people you've mentioned, who have known suffering, will heal better and further in a setting where lies haven't been told about the degree of communion which the people that organise that setting are in vis-à-vis the Church. The benefit was brought in by people who were ready to place faith in God before they entered the Way and it hasn't been snuffed out yet. (It isn't always snuffed out completely.)
DeleteAs for your own neuroses they are not a matter of public interest. Your NCW superiors have impressed on you their hang-ups about others' neuroses (resembling Scientologists).
Statements by the NCW towards civil authority, church authority and individuals have got just too much exaggeration/hyperbole/poetic "licence" ("licence" - reminds me of antinomianism!) Fast and loose with truth!
EMPHASIS: "As for your own neuroses they are not a matter of public interest."
DeleteYet this is all you get from the NCW, a litany of personal neuroses.
Francesca, that is no apology at all. Something much more specific would be effective. How about this:
Delete"I was wrong. I discovered that many Catholics on Guam, not in the Way, have an authentic Christian faith and live that faith every day. I am sorry that I said otherwise."
dear francesca,
Deleteyour comment sounds nothing like an apology. instead, it's a deflection that tries to promote the ncw. the question you need to answer for yourself is: after you arrived on guam, did you realize you were mistaken about the faith of the people on guam who are not in the neocatechumenal way?
in addition to that, your comment seems to show that you're not equipped to do missionary work. a common-sense basic rule about any kind of missionary work is: "you can't give what you don't have." from your own words, it sounds to me that you don't have it, and therefore you can't give it.
Francesca. Do you still do some spying for Tony and Pius? We noticed. Big fail.
ReplyDeleteFrancesca,
ReplyDeletePlease look closely at the Leaders of the NCW in Guam in Apuron, Pius, Quitugua, Adrian. These are Bishops and Priests who are shepherd and caretakers of God's people entrusted to them by God through their ordination. Apuron and these leaders have divided the church and have aligned themselves and are biased to the NCW communities, They along with Pius, your lead catechist have lied and mislead people in the interest of gaining ownership of property. Apuron and Pius have attempted to get a Carmelite Superior to lie on their behalf for that same property. It is not characteristic for spiritual leaders to concern themselves with the material aspects of this world and forgo the spiritual health of the people. Something Apuron and these priests mentioned have done.
Ask Your self, are these leaders taking care of God's sheep and lambs? How many sheep and lambs belong to the Lord? All of them, so why are they biased just to the NCW and disregard the others in the flock? But it is not just the leaders who exhibit prideful vice, in fact many NCW members profess that they are the way, the elect, the chosen ones, and yet disobey the approved rubrics of Church liturgy, which no one including a bishop has the authority to change. Then there is the matter of Heretical Teachings that Christ is a sinner that have been taught in the RMS seminary, teachings that attack the fundamental belief in the divinity of Christ and the Holy Trinity, which are non-negotiable teachings of the Church.
My Question to you is, if you are truly searching for the truth, for God, What are you still doing in the NCW that has leaders and catechists who lie and deceive and are instruments of division rather than building up the body of Christ? If your concern is the good things that you are experiencing in your life, understand that it is God, not the NCW who is working those miracles. Our reliance for all our needs, corporal and especially spiritual in fact our very existence should not be on man or any organization but on God alone, and his church that he founded. It is the Church that he left us as the ark of salvation in the world, and not some organization founded by man. It should be obvious the decisions of the Pope in AB Hon and AB Byrne that God is leading the church back in truth, after having been detracted by Apuron and Pius and should be an indication to you and all the NCW members to prayerfully re-evaluate what is happening in the Church in Guam, most especially your stance with the NCW.
Wondering why it took more than ten years and some blog posts to apologize.
ReplyDelete"I know I don’t have faith , I see it every day" (francesca )
ReplyDeleteoh, great.
then why are you a "missionary" ?
did you wrote that comment by yourself ?
or some well known kikos wrote that for you ?
Jeez, give me a break, Francesca, take some adult responsibility for your faith! I take it you are an adult, so be mature in your discernment. If you are a Catholic, hinge your hope and salvation on Jesus Christ present in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, and not on any human that represents God! Flawed human beings all, we cannot abrogate for ourselves the all-encompassing care and love of God. Look beyond the human structure that you cling to.
ReplyDeleteHaving your own faith declared unqualified by members of the NCW? Been there too. If this can be of any consolation, they don't even need to cross the oceans. We, the "superficial and blind ones, the childish believers" are everywhere. Neighbours, acquaintances, friends, anything will do.
ReplyDeleteThe disturbing factor in the non-apology apology, every and any critical analysis will be met as "persecution" and will not even be entertained by Francesca.
ReplyDeleteIronically, his constant refusal to acknowledge that which could help them spiritually grow explains why she claims to have little faith; but it seems lost on her.
As a decades long missionary in a movement that claims to bring people leaps and bounds to the Catholic faith, her testimonial "apology" is damning and indicative of the arrested development she claims to possess. Why have they remained in the NCW if the itinerary is static and stagnant?
" ... indicative of the arrested development she claims to possess. Why have they remained in the NCW if the itinerary is static and stagnant?" I love it Jose!
ReplyDeleteAnd, " ... you don't have it, and therefore you can't give it" - Rey. What an advertisement from Francesca!
I took my time to drop out, but I didn't believe (and therefore didn't say) anything like she is saying.