Thanks for sharing the video, Tim. I’ve heard Fr. Pacwa’s explanation before, and I respect his view. At the same time, the lived reality for many Catholics around the world is different from this strict interpretation. Faith is shaped by a person’s relationship with God, not by someone else deciding who they are allowed to be.
A lot of good, active Catholics are also Masons today. They serve their parishes, support their communities, and live moral lives. Nothing in Freemasonry teaches people to turn away from God or reject the Church.
So if someone chooses to live their Catholic faith and also be a Mason, it simply means they are following their conscience and trying to become a better person. Faith and fraternity do not have to be enemies unless someone is trying hard to make them look that way.
I’ll continue living my faith and serving my community. A video won’t change that.
Calling “good Catholic” and “Mason” an oxymoron only shows how quickly you label people instead of understanding them. A person’s faith is lived in their actions, not in the categories someone else tries to force them into
Our job isn't to understand people, our job is to understand what the One, Holy, Catholic Church believes and teaches, and to hold to it. The bottom line issue is that the Church you say you belong to teaches one thing and you believe another. As I've said elsewhere, you are not alone, in fact you are with the majority of Catholics who are okay with abortion, same-sex marriage, ignoring the Sunday duty, and apparently Freemasonry.
I really do hope that you are not one of the candidates for governor or we will be out of the frying pan and into the fire if you get elected. Anyone with half a brain can see that Fr. Pacwa is NOT sharing "his view." Once again, as I stated to another of your replies, you would make an excellent protestant.
No need to worry, Tim. I am not running for anything, so the dramatic warnings are unnecessary. What you call “having half a brain” is simply a refusal to accept that every Catholic on earth must think exactly the same way you do.
Fr. Pacwa gives one explanation. The Church has offered many over the centuries. And Catholics are capable of understanding teaching, history, and conscience without being labeled “Protestant” every time they disagree with someone on a blog.
You keep trying to win the argument by belittling people instead of addressing the actual point: many sincere Catholics live their faith and contribute to their parishes while also being Masons. Their lives show no conflict with God, and no video changes that lived reality.
If your position is strong, you do not need insults to defend it. I’ll continue practicing my faith with sincerity and serving my community with integrity. That is what matters most.
Well, indifferentism (google it) and loyalty to Christ divided by secret oaths undergirded by deism certainly can be an enemy of Faith. One reason this is probably hard for you to see is that our society is soaked through and through by a moralistic therapeutic deism that is hardly ever called out in the pulpit.
Indifferentism is not the issue here, because that would require Freemasonry to teach that all religions are equal or that Christ is optional for salvation. It does not teach that. People repeat the claim often, but repetition is not proof.
There are no secret oaths of loyalty that replace God or faith. The obligations in Masonry focus on personal conduct and character, not theology. Anyone who has actually talked to real members, instead of relying on assumptions, would understand that.
What you are describing is a theoretical danger, not the real experience of many Catholics who live their faith fully while also being part of a fraternity that promotes charity, integrity, and service. Their lives show no conflict with their devotion to Christ.
You are correct that society deals with shallow spirituality, but that does not mean every Catholic Mason is confused or compromised. Many are active in their parishes, strong in their faith, and committed to God.
The idea that a Catholic loses faith simply by joining a fraternity does not match reality. A strong argument should be based on facts, not on assumptions about people who are actually living both faith and service with sincerity.
The Church is very clear when she declared, "Precisely by considering all these elements, the Declaration of the Sacred Congregation affirms that membership in Masonic associations «remains forbidden by the Church», and the faithful who enrolls in them «are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion».
This declaration cannot be diluted by how those Catholics who remain members of the Freemasons AND have knowledge of this declaration "feel." It's clear and concise. This was affirmed in 1983 and most recently in 2023. That's the bottom line.
I suspect that, at the very least, the Church would need to see a copy of your secret rituals and oaths, Anonymous Freemason, before changing her mind.
If the Church needs a copy of the rituals, you might want to sign up and grab them yourself. I hear the paperwork is easier than joining a parish council
Actually, "the Church," specifically the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith," already has them, which is why Freemasonry remains a prohibited society and members or prohibited from receiving communion.
Thanks for sharing the video, Tim. I’ve heard Fr. Pacwa’s explanation before, and I respect his view. At the same time, the lived reality for many Catholics around the world is different from this strict interpretation. Faith is shaped by a person’s relationship with God, not by someone else deciding who they are allowed to be.
ReplyDeleteA lot of good, active Catholics are also Masons today. They serve their parishes, support their communities, and live moral lives. Nothing in Freemasonry teaches people to turn away from God or reject the Church.
So if someone chooses to live their Catholic faith and also be a Mason, it simply means they are following their conscience and trying to become a better person. Faith and fraternity do not have to be enemies unless someone is trying hard to make them look that way.
I’ll continue living my faith and serving my community. A video won’t change that.
Trying to convince yourself that "good Catholics" are Masons, is the definition of oxymoron
DeleteCalling “good Catholic” and “Mason” an oxymoron only shows how quickly you label people instead of understanding them. A person’s faith is lived in their actions, not in the categories someone else tries to force them into
DeleteOur job isn't to understand people, our job is to understand what the One, Holy, Catholic Church believes and teaches, and to hold to it. The bottom line issue is that the Church you say you belong to teaches one thing and you believe another. As I've said elsewhere, you are not alone, in fact you are with the majority of Catholics who are okay with abortion, same-sex marriage, ignoring the Sunday duty, and apparently Freemasonry.
DeleteI really do hope that you are not one of the candidates for governor or we will be out of the frying pan and into the fire if you get elected. Anyone with half a brain can see that Fr. Pacwa is NOT sharing "his view." Once again, as I stated to another of your replies, you would make an excellent protestant.
ReplyDeleteNo need to worry, Tim. I am not running for anything, so the dramatic warnings are unnecessary. What you call “having half a brain” is simply a refusal to accept that every Catholic on earth must think exactly the same way you do.
DeleteFr. Pacwa gives one explanation. The Church has offered many over the centuries. And Catholics are capable of understanding teaching, history, and conscience without being labeled “Protestant” every time they disagree with someone on a blog.
You keep trying to win the argument by belittling people instead of addressing the actual point: many sincere Catholics live their faith and contribute to their parishes while also being Masons. Their lives show no conflict with God, and no video changes that lived reality.
If your position is strong, you do not need insults to defend it. I’ll continue practicing my faith with sincerity and serving my community with integrity. That is what matters most.
"Faith and fraternity do not have to be enemies"
ReplyDeleteWell, indifferentism (google it) and loyalty to Christ divided by secret oaths undergirded by deism certainly can be an enemy of Faith. One reason this is probably hard for you to see is that our society is soaked through and through by a moralistic therapeutic deism that is hardly ever called out in the pulpit.
Indifferentism is not the issue here, because that would require Freemasonry to teach that all religions are equal or that Christ is optional for salvation. It does not teach that. People repeat the claim often, but repetition is not proof.
DeleteThere are no secret oaths of loyalty that replace God or faith. The obligations in Masonry focus on personal conduct and character, not theology. Anyone who has actually talked to real members, instead of relying on assumptions, would understand that.
What you are describing is a theoretical danger, not the real experience of many Catholics who live their faith fully while also being part of a fraternity that promotes charity, integrity, and service. Their lives show no conflict with their devotion to Christ.
You are correct that society deals with shallow spirituality, but that does not mean every Catholic Mason is confused or compromised. Many are active in their parishes, strong in their faith, and committed to God.
The idea that a Catholic loses faith simply by joining a fraternity does not match reality. A strong argument should be based on facts, not on assumptions about people who are actually living both faith and service with sincerity.
The Church is very clear when she declared, "Precisely by considering all these elements, the Declaration of the Sacred Congregation affirms that membership in Masonic associations «remains forbidden by the Church», and the faithful who enrolls in them «are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion».
DeleteThis declaration cannot be diluted by how those Catholics who remain members of the Freemasons AND have knowledge of this declaration "feel." It's clear and concise. This was affirmed in 1983 and most recently in 2023. That's the bottom line.
I suspect that, at the very least, the Church would need to see a copy of your secret rituals and oaths, Anonymous Freemason, before changing her mind.
ReplyDeleteIf the Church needs a copy of the rituals, you might want to sign up and grab them yourself. I hear the paperwork is easier than joining a parish council
ReplyDeleteActually, "the Church," specifically the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith," already has them, which is why Freemasonry remains a prohibited society and members or prohibited from receiving communion.
ReplyDelete