Sunday, June 1, 2014

INSULTING FILIPINOS


The NEO from Guam are headed to the PI to evangelize the Filipino people. Is that laughable or what? The PI where Masses are overflowing, where the poor are rich in spirit, where there is a chapel in most shopping malls, where the suffering are consoled, where marriage is protected, where families are encouraged, where Masses are held in offices during Lent because Churches cannot satisfy the demand, where abortion is still illegal, where
vocations are flourishing, where commerce shuts down during Holy Week, and where her people are loving, open, caring, and hospitable. We are spending all that money to do that? Huh? Actually, they are not going to evangelize, but to pay homage to their prophet and king, Kiko, under the ruse that Cardinal Tagle invited Kiko and us. The strategy was working until Tim flushed them out.

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My note: The above comment refers to the headline in the U Matuna, May 18, 2014: Pilgrimage to Manila. Guam youth headed to Manila to evangelize in June.  Of course what is meant by the headline is that they are going to Manila to evangelize "regular Catholics" for the Neocatechumenal Way.

81 comments:

  1. It is true that the churches in Manila are jam packed for masses. One could see people standing outside the churches due to no more room. Image parishes having about 8 masses on a given Sunday and each mass has standing room only! The churches do not even have aircons. The kneelers and pews are wooden! Even the old and disable kneel with reverence! This says much about their Catholic Faith! Some churches have masses that are bilingual to accommodate people like me who does not understand the language. Even the mass held at the Glorietta mall, Robinson mall, Greenbelt, etc. are packed.

    The Catholic Faith is very much alive in Manila.

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    1. Hmmm.....maybe that is why Guam's first saint is a Filipino and not the Spaniard. We now have the second invasion of the Spaniards....the NCW. We kicked them out in 1898 and now they are back with our Archbishop rolling out the red carpet for them. Yup...they can't seem to get over their conquering and imperialistic ways! And shame on us for being stupid enough to let them come in, again, sowing seeds of division this time. Divide and conquer is their strategy, and it is working,

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    2. I understand that there are about 100 Neo youths including the Neo seminarians that are going to Manila. Here is what I think it is going to cost. Hotel, food, air fare, land transportation, taxes, and misc items. I would say about $1,000 per person, or $100,000 for the whole group. Don't you think we can better use that $100,000 in Guam than in Manila where the Catholic Faith is strong and flourishing. That is like sending a contingent of musical group from Guam to Manila to teach the Filipinos how to sing! LOL. The Faith of the Filipinos is like their innate musical talent: it is in their blood. What a waste of our money and time! Or, is their another motive for sending this Neo group to Manila because it is certainly not to evangelize?

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    3. It is a RUSE, and a very expensive one, just to satisfy the ego and vanity of the Kikos.

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    4. Anon 5:08 pm...St Pedro Calungsog is not even considered a saint for Guam. He is a saint for Manila. Saint Pedro Calongsong was not Archbishop Apuron's top priority. It is Blessed Diego Sanvitores that he will claim should he be declared as Saint.

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    5. It wasn't your money that's sending them there. You didn't put in a single penny.

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    6. Anon at 8:20pm --- Oh, but it is . . . AAA money being used. If not directly, money that could be put towards it. Remember, the biggest percentage of AAA money goes to the RMS. This appeal means nothing if the "communities" choose to throw their money away the same way our "airport bishop" does as well.
      Priorities.
      Imagine a kid demands that his financially struggling parents save and give him their money for his tuition, but spends his own money on world trips and excursions that could have went into his education fund. Why should the parents continue to respond to their kid for help if he himself is being frivolous? I wouldn't blame the parents for stopping their contributions at the same time, think that the money they already contributed is their money being spent.
      You see, when the NCW or the Archbishop hold a gala or appeal and receive our money, yet spend massive amounts of money on unnecessary hotel fees for or off-island excursions, even if they claim it did not come directly from the gala or AAA accounts, essentially, they are still spending our money.

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    7. To ANON 8:20 PM, whenever one donates to the Church in Guam, as I have, one expects that the Church uses said funds wisely as that is the Church's duty to do so. For example, there were several bishops that were disciplined by Rome recently for spending lavishly to build their homes. The question before us: why is this archdiocese spending all this money to send a contingent of people to Manila to evangelize? Something fishy is going on.

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    8. Is Archbishop going to Manila too?

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    9. Many youth who are heading to Manila have paid out of their own pocket.

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    10. Money donated to any church cause must only be used for the intention of the donar. When people give to the archbishops appeal it goes to the archdiocese. The archdiocese should use it to provide the ministries the archdiocese needs and the education of young men who desire to be diocesan priests. It is not given for airfares to any place. So it is important we know exactly who pays for this unnecessary off island trip. How many are going, airfare costs, here are they staying. All this we need to identify for an estimate of billings of our money he spent.

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    11. All money having any connection to the activities of the Neocatechumenal Way has relative consequences for the church which hosts it. If members are contributing to this or that exclusive neo activity or event, that is money that is not going to the host parish or diocese. And because the Neo is not an autonomous corporate entity as is the Knights of Columbus or any of the other incorporated church organizations, money collected in the name of any neo activity ultimately belongs to its host, which is the parish. It is then up to the parish/pastor on how to distribute the funds. Of course the Neo bypasses the parish and acts as its own entity. I simply say, if you want to be your own entity, then be your own entity and stop pretending you are part of our church.

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    12. Anonymous (June 2, 2014 at 9:54 AM), yes he is. The Archbishop announced at the 6PM Mass on Saturday, 31 May, that he would be traveling to the Philippines with the youth of the Archdiocese and would not be back in time for the funeral of Deborah Babauta,on Saturday, 7 June, which was the reason he was celebrating the Mass that evening.

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    13. The NCW is more important the celebrating the funeral Mass of one of the parishioners who gave her voice in praise to The Lord by singing in the Agana Choir. Then again, let the dead bury their dead

      I wonder if he hopes that Cardinal Tagle will entertain him!

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    14. That may be true that many of the neo youth going to Manila are paying the costs out of their own pocket(or more likely the pocket of their parents) but they are doing so under the ILLUSION and LIE that Cardinal Tagle has personally invited them. In the secular world, companies get prosecuted for false advertising. We should allow the same thing for the Church.

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    15. Anonymous (June 2, 2014 at 12:35 PM), the Archbishop mentioned that he actually got to know Deborah when he was "Father Tony" in Agat 38 years ago. It was out of friendship for the family and his appreciation for her years of musical ministry that he took the time to celebrate the Mass on Saturday. He even mentioned that it was good that there were no fiestas scheduled that weekend; otherwise he wouldn't have been able to be present.

      PLUS, let us recall that, in the mindset of the NCW, nothing is allowed to take precedence, lest they be considered IDOLS. Therefore, the Archbishop is doing what he is supposed to do as a member in good standing and putting the NCW before the funeral of someone who has served the Church for more than 3 decades. In his mind, he has honored Deborah's years of service by celebrating that Mass in the presence of her family and friends.

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    16. Yup...that how the archbishop thinks. He shows a little service and he thinks he done more than he should. The archbishop only knows how to receive, not to give. For him, it is by receiving is what will lead him to heaven. Oops! I forgot. UNLESS you are the NCW.

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  2. Hang on guys . Filipinos and Filipino priests have long been insulted on Guam and Saipan. Filipino priests return to Manila with accounts of their treatment in these pacific islands. This was was reported again on jungle watch last week. Many Guam priests are seen socializing in Manila and yet last week on one priest of Guam a father mike comes forward and defends the Filipino. What is going on here. Then today junglewatch reports that Guam is coming to Manila at the request of the cardinal archbishop to evangelize the people. Is Guam again insulting the priests of Manila, the priests of the Philippines. Indeed are they insulting our archbishop of Manila. We do have ways to deal with this if you are insulting the Filipino church. Already priests are talking of their bad treatments in the pacific. Letters of archbisho Apuron to Filipino priests are circulated in Manila, and honestly little respect here for you. You can come, we will smile, but sure happy to see you go, and yes thanks for spending your USD with us.

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    1. hahahaha! great comment.
      Tim, need to put a like button on here.

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    2. Archbishop Apuron is known to stay in the plush five star makati shangri la hotel. May be the funds are used for him to stay in that hotel.

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  3. Tim, the Philippine Constitution bands abortion. Why would the Philippines want the youth of Guam to evangelize our young people. Yes, they are welcome guests to the country, and Filipinos work at good relations . But for the archbishop to inform your place that their presence is requested here to evangelize is insulting to us. They are welcomed guests , but please respect the church in the Philippines.

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  4. Widely known that when bishop tagle was bishop of a small diocese in cavite archbishop Apuron snub him. May be archbishop Apuron never expected him to be the cardinal archbishop of Manila or papal candidate. Remember the past.

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    1. once an older filipino gentlemen who was quite generous to the church asked him if he spoke tagalog (since the name apuron has filipino origins). he coldly replied: "i have no filipino blood."

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    2. It is unfair that you are speculating about the Archbishop like that. Where is your proof?

      Are you calling him out as a racist? He is our Archbishop and deserves respect as such. Try walking in his shoes for once and show him the support like his Neo Communities do. All you people can do is spit venom.

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    3. Any time someone accuses us here on JungleWatch as exhibiting the characteristics of a viper, all I do is proclaim, "Remember Gofigan!"
      Don't you dare accuse us of venomous actions without holding those who do the true spewing and spitting accountable!

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    4. The archbishop has firmly stated that he has "no filipino blood."

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    5. And so what if he stated that? You are seriously calling him out for that? Both his parents are Chamorro! Get a grip people!

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    6. You weren't there. I was. It was an older Filipino gentleman who had just given a large donation to Catholic Social Services. The Archbishop was present. And to make conversation the Filipino gentleman asked the Archbishop if he spoke Tagalog. All he had to do was say no. He didn't. He turned to the Filipino gentleman and said with a deep sneer: "I have no Filipino blood!" My friend has never forgotten. And he is not alone.

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    7. I have spoken with the Archbishop. He is not easy to speak with. Conversation doesn't flow well because he is not comfortable around just any person.

      I have seen him converse with Filipinos as well with no animosity whatsoever. This "deep sneer" is your interpretation of his personality which is dry and may seem unfeeling. He simply answered that he wasn't Filipino. Maybe you and the gentlemen are just too touchy.

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    8. I have had many dealings with the Archbishop too and have never had cause to suspect racism, but I have never had much of an "ear" for racism and the whole arguments over it are foreign to me.

      It appears the issue in the above scenario is the disconnected and disproportionate response to the question: Do you speak Tagalog? The fact that the Archbishop took it to mean "Are you a Filipino?" and then replied with "I have no Filipino blood". Well, forget about the "deep sneer", the answer alone is problematic.

      I can only imagine the people I would offend if I answered "I have no Chamorro blood" when I am mistaken for a person of local origin, which because of my dark complexion I often am. I simply smile, thank them for the compliment, and explain my Mexican ancestry and end with a joke that almost everyone understands: "those Spaniards got around."

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    9. Apuron is not a Chamorro name. When someone asked me if I spoke Tagalog because of my Filipino last name, I tell them no but I also say I wish I could. It's my loss.

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    10. Nationality not important . Back to the issues.

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  5. We will show him the respect as a catholic archbishop but he is not important to Manila.

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    1. While I was assigned to a unit in Korea, I usually observed a senior non-commissioned oficer admonish a soldier by telling him to "shape Up or be replaced by a KATUSA (a Korean soldier assigned to a US Army unit), maybe some one should advise the "Hill Group" to behave and take care of the Catholics on Guam or they can be replacd by aq Filipino priest and bishop

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    2. Hey, if Guam is sending all these people to Manila to learn from the Filipino people, then maybe it is worth it. But wouldn't it be more economical if Guam just paid for Cardinal Tagle way and stay in Guam so that he can catechize the people of Guam? Just a thought.

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    3. Very good point. Archbishop could have invited cardinal tagle to Guam.
      Let's remember pope Francis goes to Manila January. So our dear archbishop will be already looking to gain favor in the Philippines for when the pope goes there.

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    4. 11:18AM Brilliant observation! The Pope will be in Manila in January, YES!

      That's exactly why kiko wants to join Cardinal Tagle and mingle with Manila hierarchy clergy!! What better excuse and very subtle way of sneaking into an unsuspecting event “an event for the youth!"
      TO: SCHMOOZE!
      TO INGRATIATE HIMSELF AND RUB ELBOWS WITH MANILA ARCHDIOCESE HIERARCHY!
      TO CHECK OUT PLACES AND PEOPLE WHO WILL BE USEFUL TO HIM (kiko)
      TO CHECK OUT V.I.P. WHO CAN SITUATE kiko TO BE IN THE RIGHT PLACE, AT THE RIGHT TIME FOR PHOTO OPS WITH THE POPE AND THE RIGHT PEOPLE etc. etc. etc.!!!

      That's Why! OMG! That was brilliant, brilliant observation, June 2, 11:18AM !

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  6. I been to the PI many times and let me tell you: Guam or the NCW has nothing to offer them in terms if evangelizing. On the contrary, we should learn from how the Filipinos survive through all their sufferings and hardships, not with a long face, but with a smile. They are full of Joy in every sense of that word. To paraphrase the post above, many of them may be poor but all of them are rich in spirit. God bless them.

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  7. If I were a Filipino Catholic I might show Archbishop Apuron respect on account of his office, but I would not welcome his presence in the Philippines. In fact, I would protest it. He's going there to convert Catholics to Kikoism. He thinks that the regular Catholic Church in the Philippines is not filled with the Spirit, is dry, is immature, and has not yet received Jesus. Is this someone who Filipino Catholics should welcome -- even briefly -- to their country? I don't think so.

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  8. For thirty years Archbisjop Apuron did nothing for Guam. Can you point to anything he built, a school, a hospital, a project that can be identified with him. There is nothing. But look at bishop Flores and the many things he did for Guam. Archbishop Apuron inherited all archbishop Flores did but did nothing. But he did. He allowed the NCW to come here and destroy all that archbishop Flores did for us.

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    1. You are fantasizing that Archbishop Flores was altruistic and perfect. Don't put Arch. Flores on a pedestal as if he was a saint. He was a man with faults like the rest of us.

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    2. No it's true that Archbishop Flores was not perfect -- just as the rest of us are not perfect, but human -- but he was a Leader, he was our the Catholic Leader for Guam and he did Shepherd his Catholic flock.

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    3. The comment says nothing about Flores being "perfect". It simply mentions his accomplishments and compares them to Apuron's.

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    4. Correct Tim. Archbishop Flores was human like all of us. I am not saying he was perfect not for me to say. But he gave leadership and he accomplished in his years. Am simply trying to list the accomplishments of Archbisjop Apuron and honestly not many. I'm trying to included st. Thomas aquinas school to give him that, that is being generous. It is hard to list any accomplishments.b

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    5. Flores was a leader: decisive, charismatic, compassionate, and brilliant. Can anyone say the same for Apuron?

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    6. Apuron is not for Aquinas High School so don't put that on list.

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  9. Archdiocese of Manila is an effective and dynamic center of spirituality and evangelization. Enhanced by a lay leadership and excellent priests. Unfortunately, archbishop Apuron looks down on the Philippines . This was shown to us in his words actions past years. Sad fact is he has Filipino blood.

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  10. Many many groups lay movements are organized in the Philippines. But parishes evangelize and people join groups that help them grow in their faith life. Filipinos will join what they want they do not need people from Guam telling them what to do. It seems the archbishop just wants to bring a large group from Guam to give him status and printed his story to support his dream.its ok to dream but please do not change the facts to support your dream or a dream becomes delusional. If it has not already.

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  11. Should we be surprised by this? After all, Kiko Arguello is apparently so convinced of his theological calibre that, just like the scribes and priests who sought to "educate" Christ about the law, he sees fit to catechize to the POPE himself.
    Should we really be shocked that his herd have that same arrogance, that they would dare to preach and evangelize to a people whose Catholic faith and conviction is exponentially stronger and brighter than theirs ever will be?

    And I say this as a lifelong resident of Guam, I have no delusions about the state of our Church. Quite frankly, it SUCKS right now--from the staggering number of "Holiday Catholics" who don't attend Sunday Mass, the laity who have no problem supporting same-sex unions and using contraception and voting for senators with obvious anti-life political platforms, an Archbishop more concerned with personal comforts than with guiding his flock, and now with this growing cult of individuals who refuse to conform to the liturgical style of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church in favour of their own Protestant-esque services-- If anything it is the Philippines who ought to be sending more of their own to Guam, to teach and correct the errors of our Diocese, as Christ Himself commanded (Matthew 18:15).

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  12. But if there's no NEO in PI then how will the poor souls in PI know who Jesus is. According to the NEO Jesus came to Guam in the 90's. Taking the NEO's logic I would be inclined to think St. Pedro Calungsog and Fr. San Vitores were fakes or at least their works were all in vain.

    Sorry Neo, but I'll stick with the Magisterium thank you!

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  13. Does anyone know if Archbishop Apuron has apologized to Cardinal Tagle for the fabricated story?

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    1. No proof the invitation was fabricated. And if you are looking for that to slap down the Archbishop with your righteousness, then you have already reaped your reward of malice.What happened to charity and humility?

      I'm sorry Tim, I was behind the cause, but with all this finger pointing and calling for the Archbishop's head, I think you need to cool your head off for a few days and focus on what is right, not just the justification of being right. I think you are losing sight of the real reason you started this in the first place.

      Your post the last few days seems as though you are digressing to what you call the kikos out to be, but I think you are better than that.

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    2. Nice try. But if you are sincere, then come and see me.

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    3. At 1:42 pm ...there is a letter!

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    4. To ANON June 2 at 12:54 PM:

      Here is how you can easily check if a letter was sent by Cardinal Tagle stating that the Umatuna article that he invited Kiko is plain wrong. Call Jennifer Dulla, or Tony Diaz, or Sister Marian Arroyo and ask them? You will also see that the article posted on the Umatuna website was deleted abruptly, obviously right after they had received the letter from Tagle. I am sure you know one of the three, and if they give you a copy of the letter, please share it with us. :) We can't have Mr. Rohr pulling out all the rabbits out of the hat. lol.

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    5. Sorry, my bad. That last reply was directed to ANON 1:42 PM.

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    6. Hey Anonymous at 1:42 PM,

      I don't get you. Why are you castigating Tim for exposing this fraud of an article falsely claiming that Cardinal Tagle invited Kiko and the Neos from Guam to come to Manila and evangelize? You should instead be castigating(or slap down as you say) Archbishop Apuron for fabricating this lie, or, as the publisher of the Umatuna, for allowing such a lie to be published. Tim did not create the lie; he merely exposed it. So, thank him for exposing the Truth. Otherwise, many of us would be living under that lie. As the archbishop, Apuron is held to a higher standard than any of us, as it should be. A lie is a lie so he must be held accountable. Don't you think so?

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    7. In fact I actually defended the Archbishop saying that he did NOT manufacture the lie. We KNOW who manufactured it. The question is will they come forward and save the Archbishop or with they let him burn.

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    8. If you study Tim's statements and I suggest we all do, you will notice that Tim in this case defended the archbishop as not speaking a lie. Tim stated that the NCW has told the lie through the Archbihop. Suspect this is the true case. The question becomes now will the NCW take responsibility, or will they let archbishop take the blame. This will allow observers to see what's going on. And yes the world is watching.

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  14. Talk of a letter is not a letter. And what is that going to do for anyone? Off with their heads? Disrespect Archbishop Tony and criticize him further?

    He is my Archbishop and I love him and respect as such. He needs prayers and support not malicious comments.

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    1. Sadly it took almost three decades of criticism and disrespect to finally wake up the bishops who harbored pedophile priests and shake them into the consequences of their actions. People kept quiet for decades out of "respect". Thousands were hurt and eventually billions were paid...not to mention the many lost souls. We can be sure that if Fr. Mike Crisostomo has come to JungleWatch to make a public plea to the Archbishop, then all normal paths and efforts have been exhausted. Unfortunately the only thing the Archbishop (and often bishops in general) respond to is negative press. Is this getting too "arduous and painful" for you?

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    2. Just like talk of an invitation is not an invitation.

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    3. 9:50 pm. The Archbishop needs to do the right thing. The right thing as head of this Archdiocese must take the fall and apologize to His Eminence Cardinal "Chito" Tagle.

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  15. Brother, I don't care about a letter. I can confirm on a very high authority that cardinal tagle did not invite kiko to the archdiocese of Manila. Period full stop. Matter close.

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    1. 10.11pm who are you?

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    2. I am a Priest.

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    3. Yes you are a priest! Sincerely, thank you. Amen!

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    4. Anon 10:30 PM, the Priest, is correct. Cardinal Tagle did not invite Kiko to the archdiocese of Manila. I have seen the letter. Case closed.

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    5. Please call Arch father he would like to meet with you.

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    6. 11.15pm. Thank you. Working behind stage because at the end of the day we need to return to our common ideals and values that we all share no matter who we are. It's about truth, honor and integrity.

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    7. Who is this priest we do not know he is authentic. He could be a fake it has happened on this page.

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    8. 1206am. Think this priest does know .

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    9. THIS PRIEST DEFINITELY KNOWS!

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    10. Another priest we have to get rid of.

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    11. Janet B - MangilaoJune 3, 2014 at 5:39 PM

      Anon June 3 at 10:50AM -
      Oh hello Fr Adrian. Back in the jungle again? You must really like the pain!
      Your comment "Another priest we have to get rid of." totally gives you away. It is disgusting how you relish the idea of canning otherwise good priests that don't bow down to Kiko.
      Your days are counted. Enjoy the salary while it lasts!

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    12. Since you are all pointing fingers at Father Adrian, please give the pleasure of asking him a question? Why is it that during your Saturday celebrations you use Morgan David wine instead of the Angelic wine that is used at the regular Masses?

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    13. Janet, I believe 10:50 AM might not be Fr. A, but just being sarcastic. However, you are right about Fr. A's pogrom to rid the island of competition.

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  16. Although I am amon I have identified myself to mr Rohr this evening . Personally contacted the archdiocese of Manila today to find out the truth.

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  17. Tim is correct. Thousands of children were abused by priests because bishops turned a blind eye to sexual,abuse and did nothing. As a result today dioceses are bankrupt. Mr Tim Rohr is a blessing to our church in speaking for truth and justice to restore integrity. The same is true for fr. Mike and all who stand for truth and justice in the church. With mr. Rohr we will seek the truth until we are all free of fear. We will not stop until justice and integrity has returned.

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  18. Where is the Guam group staying in Manila. Media waiting to talk with archbishop Apuron.

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  19. Manila media would like to interview archbishop Apuron .

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