Wednesday, May 13, 2015

POPE BENEDICT TO KIKO: "OBEY"

Neo's standing during the consecration at Chalan Pago

In light of all the crap that has been wrought upon this diocese by a Neocatechumenal Way that thinks they can do whatever the hell they want, and especially in light of The Diana lecturing us about "obeying Pope Benedict" (LOL), it would be good to return to the warning Benedict gave the kiko dingbats back in 2011:


Pope offers support, caution for Neocatechumenal Way
Catholic World News - January 17, 2011

In a sign of support for the Neocatechumenal Way, Pope Benedict XVI held a private audience on January 17 for members of the controversial lay movement. But the Pope also offered words of caution, stressing that members of the Neocatechumenate must work with the bishops and obey the Church’s liturgical directives.

Kiko Arguello, the founder of the Neocatechumenal Way, shared the microphone with Pope Benedict at a commissioning ceremony, in which 230 members were sent out on missions, to organize new communities in “de-Christianized” areas. [Like Guam?]

Since its founding in Spain in 1964, the Neocatechumenal Way has attracted nearly 1 million members, and has active communities in 120 countries. While drawing high praise for its energy and its ability to foster vocations, the group has also encountered criticism for some of its practices. The liturgical practices of the Neocatechumenate have drawn a rebuke from the Vatican, which insisted on adherence to universal liturgical rules. And the Japanese bishops have charged that the group promotes division among the faithful.

Pope Benedict—who has regularly joined in the annual commissioning ceremonies—expressed his appreciation for the lay movement in his remarks to this year’s meeting. He said:

For more than forty years the Neocatechumenal Way has been contributing to the revitalization and consolidation of Christian initiation in dioceses and parishes, favoring a gradual but radical rediscovery of the riches of Baptism, helping people to savor divine life, the heavenly life which the Lord inaugurated with His incarnation, when He came among us and was born like one of us.
The Pope also drew attention to the official approvals that the Neocatechumenal Way has received from the Vatican: first for its internal statutes, and then for its own “Catechetical Directory of the NeoCatechumenal Way.”

Pope Benedict cautioned, however, that these “seals of ecclesiastical approval” should be a reminder that the lay movement should work within the framework of the Catholic hierarchy, “in filial obedience to the Holy See and the pastors of the Church.” Underlining that point, the Pontiff said that the movement should “insert itself into the harmony of the ecclesial body.”

“In this light,” the Pope said to the members of the Neocatechumenal Way, “I exhort you always to seek profound communion with pastors.”


So Pope Benedict WARNS the Kikobots to "obey the Church's liturgical directives." Hmmm, now why would he be doing that unless, the Kikobots were disobeying the liturgical directives (which we all know). Now why do they do that? I was reminded of The Zoltan's answer of a year ago which I will copy here:




Chuck, I told this also to Tim: our interpretation of the liturgical books allows us to follow contemplated consumption of the Eucharist, while your interpretation would not allow this. So this is a question of interpretation. We accept that differences in interpretation are possible. You should ask for an official confirmation for your interpretation from Rome. Unless you have this confirmation, we cannot accept it and just follow ours. We ask you to, please, respect our community based Catholic lifestyle.


So you see folks, the Neocatechumenal Way views the General Instruction of the Roman Missal as the General Suggestions of the Roman Missal. They are not bound to follow what the Church directs the rest of us to follow. Only Catholics are bound to follow those directives. Zoltan, Diana, Apuron and the rest of the Kikobots are not Catholics so no need for them to obey what the rest of us must obey. Rome's rules are simply to be interpreted to their liking. 

STOP THE MONEY.

30 comments:

  1. Kenneth San AgustinMay 13, 2015 at 5:56 PM

    Agree totally. ...STOP THE MONEY!

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  2. Yeah stop the money, who's going to suffer? You.

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    1. I don't think so! I'll have the satisfaction of knowing that I did not support heresy and those who promote heretical teaching. I will have the satisfaction of knowing that my support will instead go to truly needy causes and real charitable needs. If it hastens the demise of our Church "leader" then any temporary discomfort I experience will be worth it.

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    2. At 6:50 PM, you have it the other way around you MOOCHER!! Get a real job!

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    3. hey TIM are those donations to you a write off ???

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    4. LOL, you freaks can't even insult correctly. Incomes aren't "write-offs", stupid. Come back when your other hand isn't busy.

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    5. My other hand isn't writing you f****** check stupid

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    6. Donate!!!!! to keep all this stupid s*** going

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    7. Yes, that's the idea. Enjoy! LOL!!! How fun, both a coward and a fool!!!

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    8. Donate. Yes. That's the idea. Thanks for the ad...and the laughs :)

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  3. STOP THE MONEY... STOP THE MONEY

    NO MONEY = NO tony... NO MONEY = NO tony... NO MONEY = NO tony...
    say it again
    NO MONEY = NO tony... NO MONEY = NO tony... NO MONEY = NO tony...

    STOP THE MONEY... STOP THE MONEY

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    Replies
    1. STOP THE MONEY NO TIM.........

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  4. Crystal clear. Not Catholics!

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    Replies
    1. Not Jews either. So what are they?

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  5. Did these whacko-kikos dig up old Gnostic texts in Israel or something? I have nothing against the menorah, but for what purpose do they display it? I am more convinced than ever that the rank and file NEO may be in for a terrible surprise at the end of their road.

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  6. I have been reading a book by a NCW deacon who spent some time teaching at the seminary on Guam. Mr. Thomann is the first to come forth and state that the purpose of the NCW is not to bring people back to the pews or to convert non-Catholics. He states that if the purpose of evangelization is to bring people back to the pews it will not work. Those people that have left the church are not coming back, because the church is the same. Those of us that are left in pews are in desperate need of evangelization according to him. “The largest majority of adult Catholic Christians were baptized as infants and have never received an adult formation in the faith” and the NCW is there to provide an adult formation in the faith. If we have an adult formation of Catholic faith, we will not leave the church. I will agree that many of us could use more catechism, but teaching that is more in line with the teaching from the Vatican would be much more beneficial.

    I cannot help thinking of my deceased German grandfather, who went to mass just about every day of his life. What would he think of some of teachings of the NCW – Jesus was a sinner, the lack of respect for the sacrifice of the mass, etc? Let alone a mass with guitars and tambourines around a center “altar” adorned with flowers and a menorah and no Nicene Creed.

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  7. Not quite sure if why but I see many real altars adorned with a crucifix. But when you take a look at the Kiko table with fr flor there is a menorah but no crucifix. What does THAT MEAN?

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    1. Observe the Tabernacle at Chalan Pago Church, it hosts a picture of the Last Supper. Kiko brainwashing.

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    2. Probably not a picture but a kiko icon, and probably with kiko as Jesus - as most of his icons appear to be.

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    3. Sadly, most of our altars have been without crucifixes ever since the priest turned around to face the people decades ago. Apparently it was in "the way". Imagine that. In some places a small crucifix is now placed on the altar. I noticed that Pope Francis is using one at his daily Mass in the Santa Marta chapel. Sadly, not even the GIRM requires a crucifix to be on the altar, but at least "near" it. But you're right, the presence of a pseudo-menorah is another sign that Kiko has a different church in mind.

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    4. Attended Scout Shabbat with my son Boy Scout son a few months ago at the Synagogue. It was a more reverent service than a NCW mass. I don't remember a menorah being prevalent although it is a symbol representing the Jewish faith. The lightening of the two Shabbat candles was an important part of the service.

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  8. Stopping the money,is painful for Catholics, but it is pretty much like taking castor oil, or having surgery to remove cancer. It has to be done to eliminate the disease. It is our clear signal that we regretfully are hurting our church in the process of ridding ourselves of Neos. It is also a signal to Rome that they need to address this issue before it becomes a crisis, where services, power, water, mortgage obligations held in jeopardy. Kiko understand we are not backing down, since backing down means NCW domination of Catholics on Guam, It will not happen. Kiko, you movement and grand design for Guam is doomed.

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  9. I have to admit that I didn’t think anything at first about standing during the consecration, although the youth taking a picture or playing a game was perplexing. Unfortunately, the last parish I belonged to did not have kneelers except for the first two rows. It was the custom to stand and there was no kneeling. I just thought times had changed. I learned I was wrong. Thank-you, Tim.

    “In the Dioceses of the United States of America, they should kneel beginning after the singing or recitation of the Sanctus (Holy, Holy, Holy) until after the Amen of the Eucharistic Prayer, except when prevented on occasion by ill health, or for reasons of lack of space, of the large number of people present, or for another reasonable cause. However, those who do not kneel ought to make a profound bow when the Priest genuflects after the Consecration. The faithful kneel after the Agnus Dei (Lamb of God) unless the Diocesan Bishop determines otherwise.”

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    1. Yes, sadly the kikos have done nothing more than take the disobedience (or ignorance) - so evident in many of our parishes - to the next level and institutionalize it so that it is no longer just an illicit practice or a vagary, but a norm of what they perceive their own "rite". This is why I don't have a lot of patience with some non-neo pastors who now complain.

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  10. I provide excerpts from an Zenit interview on Vatican Radio with Cardinal Arinze, 2006:

    `` Liturgical norms issued by the Holy See to the Neocatechumenal Way were the result of more than two years of work, in which seven cardinals participated at the POPES request.``

    ``The cardinal commented on the letter that his dicastery sent in the name of Benedict XVI on Dec. 1 to leaders of the Neocatechumenal Way and on the Holy Father\'s address to members of the Way on Jan. 12.``

    ``The Pope continued saying: \"Precisely to help the Neocatechumenal Way to render even MORE EFFECTIVE its evangelizing action in communion with ALL the People of God, the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments recently imparted to you in MYname certain NORMS concerning the Eucharistic Celebration, after the trial period that the Servant of God John Paul II conceded. I am sure you will attentively observe these norms that reflect what is provided for in the liturgical books approved by the Church.\"

    ``These are the Holy Father\'s words. He was saying to them: \"I have given you directives through this congregation; follow them.\"

    *Cardinal Arinze: On December 1, 2005, at the conclusion of many talks over a period of at least two years or more, our congregation wrote a two-page letter to the leaders of the Neocatechumenal Way.

    I will simply give the summary: \"In the celebration of the Holy Mass, the Neocatechumenal Way will accept and follow the liturgical books approved by the Church without omitting or adding anything.\"

    *This is the basic principle. To follow the approved books; not to add or take away.\" All the rest is detail; six more precise points are presented to respond to some petitions of the Neocatechumenal Way on matters relating to the Eucharistic celebration. ........................

    .........In regard to the homily, pronounced always by the priest or the deacon, a BRIEF OCCASIONAL intervention may be made that does not have the appearance of a homily. This can also be accepted.

    On the greeting of peace, the Neocatechumenal Way is granted the possibility of taking advantage of the indult already given, that is, that the exchange of peace take place before the Offertory, UNTIL A NEW DISPOSITION [is given].

    In regard to the manner of receiving holy Communion, the Neocatechumenal Way is granted a period of transition, of no longer than two years\' duration, to pass from the generalized way of receiving Communion among its communities -- for example, seated, using an adorned table place in the center of the church, instead of the dedicated altar -- to the normal manner for the whole Church of receiving holy Communion.

    This means that the Neocatechumenal Way must move toward the way established by the liturgical books for the distribution of the Body and Blood of Christ.*

    *... stemmed from the results of this congregation\'s examination of the way in which the Neocatechumenal Way has celebrated holy Mass for many years, as, following the approval of the statutes by the Pontifical Council for the Laity -- for a five-year period -- the rest of the Vatican dicasteries had to effect the approvals in their domain. Our congregation\'s domain is the liturgy.

    To carry out this examination, we created a mixed commission of persons named by the Neocatechumenal Way and by our congregation. In the discussions, many practices emerged which they carry out during the Mass. They were examined and it was seen that MANY of them were not done according to the approved books.

    This is the background. Everything has been examined in many sessions by the mixed commission for a period of two years or more. And a discussion also took place among seven cardinals of the Roman Curia at the request of the Holy Father, who examined everything. Therefore, this letter is the conclusion of this whole process.*
    (February 16, 2006) © Innovative Media Inc.


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  11. I find is real sad and unbelievable that seasoned Catholics in my Canadian Parish, who were happy when the New Roman Missal came about and restored kneeling during the Eucharistic Prayer in the Parish after the Pastor recently had it removed, NOW (after joining the NCW) find it perfectly acceptable to NOT KNEEL during the Eucharistic Prayer. It makes no sense.

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  12. I have found the numbers of the congregation during Sunday Masses and the amount of contributions have gone down. Many of those people can be found at the NCW Mass Saturday night. It is terrible that most of these people do not realize that the alterations are not allowed; the rest simply do not care.

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  13. re may 14 133
    "They were examined and it was seen that MANY of them were not done according to the approved books."

    Has the NCW said anything about this statement? What do the persons named by the NCW in this mixed commission say the MANY practices that were not done according to approved Liturgical Books are?

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  14. Hi Tim,
    It has been quite difficult to follow the NCW and their directive in how the Celebration of the Eucharist is to be consumed. EVEN if it is explicit in the GIRM, the NCW continues to push their "agenda". Before long, they will say it is part of "inculturation". This is plain BS!

    I better understand now after seeing, hearing, witnessing, and engaging with some of the NEOcults that whatever you say to them is just like spitting directly towards the wind. They do their best to blow it back into our faces but can't back it up with documentation other than "its somewhere...".

    What a waste of time and energy. I have really good friends who are practice the NEO worship but we all know that the practice is not approved and is VERY much ILLICIT. I believe it is an outright abuse and blatant use of of Church Authority by AAA and the two other dingbats.

    Hope Adrian is having better success in trying to get his online Canon Law degree versus the NEOcults having to convince us that their worship is endorsed by Rome. Good luck with both of these NEOcults!

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