Tuesday, March 4, 2014

HERE'S WHAT THAT ONE MILLION BUCKS A YEAR IS GOING TOWARDS

A seminarian from RMS writes (see original comment here - my comments in [red]):

You are all making an issue of MONEY. Stop and listen to yourselves. You are blaming the existence of an RMS for the neglect of the Parish Financial debts. The RMS, remains our diocesan seminary. [Okay, you need to stop and listen to yourself. The Archdiocese just published a two page long defense of the existence of your seminary VERSUS the need to establish another one that is for the formation of diocesan priests. If RMS was a diocesan seminary, NOT just a seminary located in our diocese, then there would be no need to establish a second seminary FOR this diocese. Obviously this is an admission by the Archbishop himself that RMS is NOT a diocesan seminary.]

You are the only ones creating separation, which is very sad. You do not understand the itinerary of the NCW and claim that their celebrations are a cause for division. [Ummm, maybe if your leaders would make your catechetical directory available for the rest of the world to see, like the Catholic Church does its own catechism, and maybe if you actually held your "celebrations" in a church where we could all attend, then we wouldn't have to freaking guess, would we? ]

You dont hear any members of the NCW stating they no longer belong to a parish. If you want to talk about division in this diocese, talk about those who cant even lay claim to an individual parish. [The central action of a parish is the liturgy, the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass (There, I said it "Sacrifice"! Hurt your ears?) You have your own "liturgy" (if it can be called that) SEPARATE from the parish. There is no more divisive act than that since the liturgy is the central act of church unity.]

You pick and choose what you want to attack the NCW of. [No. We "attack" everything, thank you.] Very few of you are even well versed in church doctrine, liturgical guidelines and so on. You have your own definition of a Christian Life or even Parish Life for that matter. [Ummmm, like church doctrine and liturgical guidelines matter? Matter to you? You who told the Pope to go screw himself, that you'd do things your way? And your lone grasp of authenticity is that you're getting away with it?]

I am not saying that what the Capuchins had taught us are wrong but you need to realize that their actions in how they handle the parish community is influenced by their formation and it is not the only formation that exists. I always wondered why my parish took so long to rebuild itself(the church building). I realized it was the Capuchin way of life. Money was not made of an issue. The vow of poverty sort of forced the priest to make due with what already existed, even if it meant patching an already termite infested panel with another on top of another. [HUH?]

You want priests who have attended academic institutions where they can receive degrees in psychology and business. I dont need to say more on that, it speaks for itself. [Ummm, most U.S. seminaries require a four year undergraduate degree in any field of study. So it is not WE who want our priests to have a college degree, it is the whole U.S. church, and probably most other countries too. Thus you set your little podunck institute up against the requirements of the rest of the world, but this is what the NCW itself does across the board. You know better. I don't need to say more on that, it speaks for itself.]

Nonetheless, you are saying instead of priests trained in theology, sacred scriptures and other things pertaining to a spiritual life, you would prefer a psychologist or even a business professional. [Ummm, no, but it would be helpful if they actually knew theology, sacred scriptures and other things pertaining to a spiritual life, and not just Kiko's version. Ya think?]

On another note,If you arent aware already, in every church it is highly recommended that the Holy Eucharist be reserved in a chapel suitable for private adoration and prayer. If this is impossible because of the structure of the church or local custom, it should be kept on an altar or some other place in the church that is prominent and properly decorated.(taken from the GIRM) So to say that if there is no tabernacle present on the main floor, it isnt catholic, this is just wrong. [Oh! Look who's quoting the GIRM!! The same GIRM ignored by you guys where it says (161) that the sacred species is to be consumed immediately upon reception, and the same GIRM (288) which requires the Eucharist to be celebrated in a church (which you don't). And - I'm having a hard time not saying "idiot" - but, well here, let's quote the section of the GIRM to which you refer and see if it is "highly recommended that the Holy Eucharist be reserved in a chapel suitable for private adoration and prayer."]


314. In accordance with the structure of each church and legitimate local customs, the Most Blessed Sacrament should be reserved in a tabernacle in a part of the church that is truly noble, prominent, conspicuous, worthily decorated, and suitable for prayer.[124]

The tabernacle should usually be the only one, be irremovable, be made of solid and inviolable material that is not transparent, and be locked in such a way that the danger of profanation is prevented to the greatest extent possible.[125] Moreover, it is appropriate that before it is put into liturgical use, the tabernacle be blessed according to the rite described in the Roman Ritual.[126]

315. It is more appropriate as a sign that on an altar on which Mass is celebrated there not be a tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved.[127]

Consequently, it is preferable that the tabernacle be located, according to the judgment of the Diocesan Bishop:

a) either in the sanctuary, apart from the altar of celebration, in a appropriate form and place, not excluding its being positioned on an old altar no longer used for celebration (cf. no. 303);

b) or even in some chapel suitable for the private adoration and prayer of the faithful[128] and organically connected to the church and readily noticeable by the Christian faithful.

[Thank you for demonstrating the kind of education you get at RMS. As everyone can see IT IS NOT "highly recommended" that the tabernacle be placed in some private chapel, but "in a part of the church that is truly noble, prominent, conspicuous." Get it? A part of the CHURCH. That means like the CHURCH, you know, the thing you guys don't use, that you consider to be beneath your level of worship. In fact reservation in a chapel is the very least option, option b, and even then, it is to be "organically connected and readily noticeable." Seriously folks. THIS IS EXACTLY WHY AARON WANTED TO GO OFF-ISLAND!]

You fail to realize that it is even more beautiful to know that there is Chapel Dedicated to the Word and another Chapel dedicated to the Eucharist. [Ummmm, I don't need to say more on that, it speaks for itself.]

Ive never been taught by my catechists that all those outside the community are evil. [Ummm, see Kiko's catechism, Vol 1, Pg. 82 where its says: Finally, there is a third circle, a third group of brothers and sisters, those who live a lie, who have always lied to themselves. They are those in whom Satan acts, enslaving them. Apparently you haven't been paying attention.] 

You who continue to speak of none sense give me reason to believe there is this evil that exists. I hate to come to that point ever. [You mean they teach you at RMS that evil DOESN'T exist?] I do realize though that many of you just dont understand. [Oh, well, thank you for that! Stupid us.]

Again, it will be sayed, "give us the documents and we will back down", but the way in which you all are acting says, that since you havnt presented the documents that allow you to receive communion in that manner then we will continue to be very unchristian to you and we will no longer refer to the Archbishop by his title and all you neos are minions of his. Just a sad day for this church. [Oh, I see. So the reason you won't produce "the document" is because we treat you badly. Oh, poor boy. THERE IS NO DOCUMENT. THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T PRODUCE IT! But thank you for just admitting to us that you continue to distribute communion illicitly. Yes, truly a SAD DAY for the church if you are a specimen of what the Archbishop has in mind for future priests!]

[And to further demonstrate the academic acumen required by RMS, you go and tell us exactly who you are though you think you're hiding behind Anonymous/Coward!]

By the way a little history of my formation...
Capuchin Baptized
Capuchin Reconciliation, Holy Communion and Confirmation
Diocesan Renewed and Enriched
and since you all claim a difference in the two...
Diocesan Neo Experiencing a long Walk in The Way. 
Peace! 

[So he's a local, from a Capuchin parish, and seminarian. Figure it out folks. This is what that MILLION DOLLARS a year is going towards.]

[Oh, and Peace right back at ya!]

[P.S. Keep sending us stuff.]

22 comments:

  1. Wow I'm totally speechless! This is a seminarian....and a local?!? How truly sad! I am so ashamed and a little embarrassed for him too.

    Being in a Capuchin parish doesn't qualify one as a resident expert of the Capuchin way of life or formation.This RMS seminarian should not speak of anything Capuchin, since he himself is not one. As a matter of fact, he should not be allowed to speak further in a public forum, lest he make a further fool of himself.

    R. Camacho

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  2. (If I may, I am reposting this reply initially submitted at the location of the original comment in subject above)

    Anon@ March 5, 2014 at 12:13 AM

    Please don't be dismissive of the countless number of former neo followers who have testified on this blog. Not just on Guam, but all over the world.

    The sticking point on this island is that our Archbishop is personally embedded and thus can no longer be objective to these concerns.

    It is not just about the money. It may be the issue on hand on this post, but if you have been paying attention for a little more than half a year on this blog, you would have seen that money is just one of many concerns.

    Further, this is not about pitting one order against another, one movement against another. It's about the real and documented experiences of how the Neo have separated their members from the Church through liturgical liberties, manipulation of the human spirit, and aggressive strong arm tactics here on Guam. Even Pope Francis recognized that this is occurring worldwide, and in line with how charitable he is, admonished your leadership early this year in his last audience with them!

    No matter how you try to compare it, the elephant in the room is that our Archbishop cannot act upon ANY concerns towards the neo because of his intimate involvement and refusal to view his duties as our Shepard sans the lens of the Neo leadership.

    It is great for whatever positive results you have obtained from walking the way, however, if there are elements that separate you from the Church, recognize them and correct them! Don't be so defensive! This is not about kicking you or anyone out of the Church. If that were so, nobody would take the time to point out the specifics! It would be an across the board dismissal! Pope Emeritus Benedict did a great job trying to reign it in. In words, your leadership seemingly agreed, but in actions, they continue to thumb their noses at the statutes. (With our Archbishop, it was with WORDS and ACTIONS!)

    Correct the incongruence. Be objective and research what is being said ABSENT the influence of the opinion of your "responsible," "catechist," or whomever is subjective to the Neo. Read the CCC, and other documents pertaining to your new statutes. Do not try to bend, rationalize or manipulate the CCC or other documents to your practices.

    Ask yourself why you celebrate the Eucharist separated from our Sundays. The new statutes instructed you to adhere to this; reflect on why this obligation, which is already recognized in the regular Church, had to be emphasized to the Neo.

    Recognize that you are being sold a bill of goods in relation to "early Christian liturgy." Recognize that there is absolutely no documentation to support this as authentic beyond anything Kiko has written.

    If returning to the Church is the goal, why create liturgy that is not recognizable to the Church nor has ever been in practice before Kiko and Carmen created the Neo?

    Ask yourself why Kiko and the other neo leaders remain obstinate towards the liturgies of the One Church.

    These questions are real inquiries that are not from mere opinion, but from understanding the liturgies of our Church.

    Correcting these concerns SHOULD allow you to continue in the WAY with congruence to the Church as the Church instructs.

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  3. I'm not very sympathetic to this kid, given his arrogant and condescending tone, but, dang, that was a pretty serious beatdown. And he walked right into it.

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  4. Tim, Thank you very much for explaining it all to this guy. I hope he himself understands, though I doubt he will. Further, we aren't the only ones questioning the practices of the NCW, there are so many other people all over the world who are questioning them in their own Diocese as well.

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    1. Yeah Rick R cause you can't on your own so you cling on to Tim's skirt.

      Hahahaha

      Old Man from Santa Rita -Ret USMC/LAPD/FBI and GPD

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    2. Ummm, Old Man, I XXX'd out your name in that long comment about the divorce just to protect you. Did you really want me to start using it? Everyone knows who you are. So come on out from behind "Junior's" skirt.

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    3. Ai Adai Old Man, your show of concern for me clinging is appreciated. But since you obviously don’t know me, or Tim (I’m guessing) you should know that Tim wouldn’t allow any of us to cling onto him nor would I allow myself to cling onto anyone.

      What you’re failing to realize here is that you are laughing at the wrong person. You see, I'm the one who gets it. I'm the one who understands the Citations that Tim has cited. I myself couldn’t have done that, so you’re right. But is that wrong? Is it wrong that I thanked him for doing so? The ones who you should be laughing at are people like yourselves, people in the NCW who allow themselves to be misguided by lies. Everything here in the Jungle has been back by fact, Tim has provided references for each one. All Tim, along with everyone else playing in the Jungle, is asking for, is the Document. The Document that says you are allowed to practice the way that you do. Do you understand? It shouldn't be difficult for an Old Man like yourself who is Retired from the USMC/LAPD/FBI and GPD to understand this. So I ask again, Show us the Document.

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    4. what a pitiful Old Man from Santa Rita...just pitiful.

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    5. Ric I'am no part of THE NEO. Keep guessing son, reality will hit you soon. I AM NOT PART OF THE DAMN GROUP. Get it in YOUR THICK SKULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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    6. The pitiful old man from Santa Rita is just a miserable person. I will pray for you Mr. Old Man from Santa Rita. I will ask the Lord to break your heart of stone and help you learn to be appreciative. Count your blessings, not your sorrows.

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  5. If I may suggest. It's time to bring this divisive issue to Rome. If the Arch will retire, I am sure he will recommend the Vicar General to replace him. Another NEO!

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  6. Of course what the "seminarian" completely misses is that that chapel at the seminary is a "chapel", not a church. There is no allowance for a separate chapel from a chapel for the reservation of the Blessed Sacrament. But then he's just repeating what he's taught.

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    1. We can only imagine what else they are being taught at RMS. Look at the falsity coming from there! And here we have the Archbishop telling the people that through RMS, Guam has the means to form priests...look again at your products Archbishop! This is why people go to the NON NEO priests, the ones who have undergone traditional diocesan formation - these are the priests that know what they're talking about. These are the priests who know how to celebrate the Mass properly. I highly doubt the Chancery is going to see that $1 million this year for that seminary in Yona.

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  7. Dear RMS Seminarian from Mangilao or Sinajana:

    The formation of a priest begin with a seminarian first acquiring a bachelor's degree, whether it be in philosophy, theology, economics, history, literature, etc. This liberal arts education will give the seminarian a solid foundation to build on and understand the teachings of the Church. It will also give him solid training in the art of critical thinking, analyzing, and discerning in order to be better able to spread the Good News. Once he acquires this foundation, which the RMS in Yona does not offer, he can then move on to acquiring a Master's of Divinity in theological studies, and if he passes and is accepted, is ordained . Thus, the bachelor's degree enhances and strengthens not only one's academic exercises, but more importantly, one's spiritual exercises. The Devil is clever, smart, cunning, wily and devious, and will use every trick to manipulate you, particularly your mind. This is why seminarians undergo rigorous academic and spiritual training in order to be able to fight the ways of the Devil. Ask your Catechist(or demand if you may) to please send you off to college first before you do your priestly formation at the RMS in Yona. Incidentally, I understand that the RMS in Newark send their seminarians to Seton Hall University. Now, that is what you need to undergo and receive. Don't take shortcuts! It will only hurt you in the long run.

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    1. Nicely stated and absolutely correct.

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    2. Those scheme for education for RMS is good, but one needs to be fluent in the language in which the courses are being taught.

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    3. Archbishop Apuron needs to read this entire article from Pilot Catholic News then ask Fr. Ivan Sciberras and others in NJ for practical assistance.
      The RMS seminary appears akin to junior college; graduates attend Seton Hall. Only then are they ordained.


      Father Abalon named pastor in Brockton

      By Father Robert M. O’Grady
      Posted: 9/21/2007

      BRIGHTON -- Cardinal Seán P. O’Malley has announced the appointment of Father José Manuel Abalon as pastor of St. Patrick Parish in Brockton. Father Abalon’s appointment was effective Aug. 15.

      A native of the Philippines, Father Abalon was born in Manito, Labay on Jan. 1, 1965 the 10th and last child of Remedios Mangampo Abalon and the late José Abalon. Of his eight living siblings, seven live in the Philippines as does his 92-year-old mother, Remedios. One sibling, Amante is deceased. Father Abalon has a brother, Father José Amante Abalon, who is a priest of the archdiocese of Newark. He is presently stationed at Holy Cross Parish on Grand Turk in the Turks and Caicos Islands in the Caribbean.

      Father José Manuel Abalon attended local schools in Manito and Bicol University High School in Legaspi City, Philippines. He was awarded the bachelor of science degree in electrical engineering from Bicol University and taught in that same field for some time after his graduation.

      When asked about his vocational choice, Father Abalon explained that his family’s daily praying of the rosary together and the good example of his own parish priest planted the initial seeds. After some wanderings, doubts and questions he began attending the Neo-Catechumenal Way Community at the cathedral in Legaspi City, Philippines. “So out of curiosity I also joined. I was 16 years old. Being a post-baptismal catechumenate, this charism in the Catholic Church helped me to rediscover the grace of baptism, the sacraments, the commandments, to love the Church as a mother and teacher, prayer, Scriptures, the Creed, the saints, the need to evangelize, etc. It slowly answered my questions and the vocation came back. It was a rediscovery of the unconditional love of Christ for me, my family and society,” said Father Abalon.

      While living at the Redemptoris Mater Seminary in Kearney, N.J. he completed his seminary theological studies at Immaculate Conception Seminary at Seton Hall University in South Orange, N.J. Newark’s then-Archbishop Theodore McCarrick ordained him to the priesthood at the Cathedral Basilica of the Sacred Heart on May 27, 2000.

      His first assignment was as a parochial vicar at Immaculate Conception Parish in Seacaucus, N.J., where he served until June 2005 when he was named parochial vicar at Our Lady of the Assumption Parish in East Boston.

      On Dec. 7, 2005 he was named administrator of St. Patrick Parish, Brockton and this past Aug. 15, he was appointed pastor. When asked about his hopes for his parish and his new assignment, Father Abalon cited three pressing goals: “1) to search for those who are not going to church, especially the youth and lead them to Christ; 2) to give continuing Catholic faith formation for those who are coming to church, both for parents/adults and children; and 3) to serve both English and non-English speaking parishioners.”

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  8. A million bucks for forty two seminarians - education, room board, insurance, travel, clothing, books etc,etc is 23,809.00 bucks. Way less than in state tuition . Therefore, it costs way more than that. At christmatime all go away. 2000.00 ticket to far away for forty guys, 80,000.00. Think

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  9. If it weren't so pathetic, it would be funny. Having read the post, I shut my mind off blaming the contents of the post for the migraine began with the reading of the second paragraph. You can clearly see the work of the devil in the division of the Roman Catholics and the NEO who have come to steal the souls of an almost perfect Catholic church so that they can continue to play their games on Guam, using our money for the games played. I don't understand why a seminary(of the real kind) would allow a seminarian to bash the people who are his host(s). You don't come to someone's home and insult him/er. In the meantime, we a scapegoat, a real and ordained priest who has been fired and jumping from church to church to continue to be a priest. If he weren't so dedicated, he could apply for a teaching job at UOG and earn just under $64K, teaching theology, those with the view would learn much about the Catholic Church from their teacher. I don't understand why the issues of abuse and schism hasn't reached the Holy Father. Surely he would not allow the devils to play on an island that used to boast 98% Roman Catholic. I don't understand how the money still finds itself to line the deep pockets of the local NEO leader, Apuron. They should stand for the church, protect it from evil, overseeing the collection and disbursement of funds collected as well as protect the possibility of changing the holder of land titles. It is sad that today, my aunt Mary Inez Underwood made the historical collection of women who are noted for being the first of something great. My aunt co-founded the convent for the Religious Sisters of Mercy, co-founded the Cathedral Grade School and the Academy of Our Lady of Guam...How sad it is to celebrate the happy news when inside you feel that the church is crumbling around you. These are sad days for those truly looking to have God in their lives only to be cheated by the pride and ego of a bishop.

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  10. Shocked at the lack of theological understanding of this seminarian whoever he is. If he wrote like this in st. Patrick's seminary San Francisco he would have problems with his academic formation.

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  11. To be clear, I am not a seminarian. Thank You to Tim for blowing my comment way out of proportion and adding his deciphering skills to each line. You didnt have to do that, it was plain and simple.

    You continue to talk about how big of an issue it is for the people of Guam to be forking out a bill for the formation of "foreigners" . What the people need to be reminded is that the faith landed on our shores in the form of a "foreigner". This foreigner originates from a country that many of these mission families also have left behind to come to Guam to spread the Good News.

    You continue to say that you all represent the People of Guam and their hurts, complaints and years of neglect from our Archbishop. I agree with Ro Underwood, these are sad days, because all you continue to portray here through your comments and the comments that you allow, is that we are a cold people, a people unappreciative to the zeal that has landed on our shores to help us with the faith.

    To be even more clear, cause I thought you would understand, The Parish I belong to was ran by the Capuchins for many years at where I was able to celebrate the Sacraments of Reconciliation, Holy Communion and Confirmation. Not too long after, the Diocesans took over and now we have a Diocesan formed in the RMS. You take a guess at the exact Parish. That though is not important.


    TIM:
    What is important is how marvellous are your marketing skills? I admire how you held your composure really well during the PNC news interview but on your blog it continues to be a no holds bar with your comments.

    You and Chuck White already have a history of always wanting to be right. Always wanting to have the last word in any situation. I cant forget the online debate that you had with Father Michael Crisostomo. Your righteousness will not save you. It is indeed a sad day on Guam, because in the same way we hate foreigners free-loading, we continue to listen to "foreigners" and their blogs. I dont care about Tim and Chuck, I care for all of you being deceived by these two and falling in the middle of their political fight with the Archbishop. Its a long plight but I guess youre hoping that one day Fr. Eric will be our Archbishop. He is a good candidate indeed, if he would just stop traveling to Manila every month for his shopping sprees and promotion of the TLM to his kababayans.

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    1. Thanks for that. You've once again earned your own post. http://junglewatch2.blogspot.com/2014/03/see-you-on-tv.html

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