Thursday, July 23, 2015

ARCHBISHOP APURON, THIS IS NOT JUST "BAD THEOLOGY"

Come to the CCOG meeting in Agat tonight to learn more.

The following conversation was excerpted from a transcript of Archbishop Apuron's visit to the Toto parish.

PARISHIONER (1:00:01)
...I’m confused because being born a Catholic and being raised a Catholic Jesus is not a sinner. But on his homily, he said that He was a sinner. So is this the Neo way of how we perceive Jesus? As Jesus being a sinner? And if it is then I think this whole thing has confused a lot of people and it has probably caused a lot of things the way people perceive their homily and how they preach their way. So I just wanted to confirm with you and ask if Jesus is a sinner.

ARCHBISHOP (01:01:34)
Well I’d like to know who that priest is… protestant. (Conjecture) But I did ask the question in one of the Confirmation kids when I tested, and sometimes I test the kids before Confirmation in the church, and the kid goes to school at Father Duenas and my question to him was, “Did Jesus sin?” and he said, “Yes.”, and then I said, “Wow.”


ARCHBISHOP (01:02:05)
<inaudible> But no, He’s not a sinner. He appeared to be sin and caught by sins as if He were a sinner and that’s how he died <inaudible> sinless. <inaudible> Honestly I’d like to know who that priest is so that <inaudible> and tell him that’s wrong theology.

The full transcript can be found here.

MY COMMENT

Dear Archbishop Apuron:

The priest's name is Fr. Angelo Veraldi. He was invited to Guam by YOU last year to teach at RMS. Having been invited by you he was teaching in your name. More likely, he was told to come here by Gennarini and Pius, whom you slavishly serve. But you are the archbishop and you are responsible. 

Here are the priests words:
 He experienced the forgiveness of the Father, because he was a sinner.  He became a sinner.  Willing, not because he was imposed, because he was a sinner, willingly, willing a sinner.

This isn't just "wrong theology", Archbishop. 

This is a FUNDAMENTAL HERESY. 

If Jesus is a sinner then Jesus isn't God. That Jesus IS God, "consubstantial with the Father" is FUNDAMENTAL to all else. But to you it's only "bad theology"? What???

A heresy is being taught at your invitation, Archbishop! The recording from which that teaching was transcribed was from a class this heretic priest taught to our permanent diaconate candidates. We have to assume that since he taught at RMS, that he also taught this to the guys who are to be our parish priests, some of whom already are. 

We also have to assume that since this was taught at RMS, that this is a Neo-teaching: that Jesus is NOT God. 

Actually we don't have to assume it. Kiko teaches it here.

Archbishop, you are the sponsor of HERESY in the Archdiocese of Agana.


32 comments:

  1. wow... then my Catholic faith is not the true faith...

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    1. I don't know anything about your faith formation but as long as you follow the doctrines of the Catholic Church you remain a Catholic. Understand that Kiko was converted to Catholicism and teamed up with a defrocked nun to start the NCW. Given what we now know about Kiko and the NCW it is a stretch to say that Kiko has supernatural faith, yet his followers believe him to be a prophet and, most recently, a saint. It also has been exposed that Kiko's brand of theology is not true to form as per the doctrines of the Catholic Church. The ones who are not true Catholics are those who do not conform to Church doctrines, doctrines that cannot be changed.

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    2. Joseph A. SantosJuly 24, 2015 at 6:45 AM

      Anon 6:11 if you follow this priest teaching that "Jesus is a sinner", then no your "Catholic faith is not the true faith". Jesus is not a sinner! Jesus is God, he died willingly for our sins. He did not willingly become a sinner!

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    3. Mary Lou Garcia-PeredaJuly 24, 2015 at 11:54 AM

      Joseph A. Santos at 6:45 AM, I think Anon 6:11 is just being facetious.

      To be honest, I had a similar reaction — "Hmmmm … I guess AAA is saying that my Catholic faith is not the true faith" — which elicited a wry chuckle at how ludicrous the NCW teaching that "Jesus is a sinner" actually is.

      St. Athanasius, pray for us!

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  2. Chuck – Having read your writing on this issue from the Link I saw posted , above, allow me to add my 2¢ worth of comment. This is just my own thought, but I perceive that perhaps because Kiko did not truly understand the Mystery of the Blessed Trinity [how can he? – It is just that: a mystery!], he needed to explain it to his disciples in terms that they can understand him, and believe him, i.e. through his prophetic words and inspired paintings.

    This sad situation is reminiscent of one of the greatest theologians of his time (St. Augustine of Hippo) and the legend behind his own grappling with the Mystery of the Blessed Trinity. As the legend goes, Augustine was contemplating this mysterium fidei when he noticed a boy going back and forth with his pail dumping water from the ocean into the beach. When Augustine asked the boy what he was attempting to do, the boy simply replied “I am going to empty the ocean water into the beach!” When accosted by Augustine that that is an impossible task, the boy replied “I will do this first, Augustine, before you can even begin to understand the Trinity” – and then disappeared! This may be just a made-up story, a legend – but the point is clear!

    Kiko – considered a prophet by his followers – is perhaps under the same dilemma with Augustine, but with this difference: Augustine walked away “believing”, while Kiko walked away “explaining”.

    Because it cannot be humanly understood, therefore it is not true. To bluntly deny it, however, is too much of a dastard statement for Kiko to make, and his disciples may be tempted “to also go away” – as Christ had also asked His disciples when He told them about his “real body and real blood” that He wanted them to eat and drink! So Kiko feigns his explanation in the best way he knows how: art and deception!

    While perhaps 99.99% of Kiko’s disciples may find it hard to deny the Trinity (they still all make the sign of the Cross “in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit” – don’t they?) – and therefore outwardly continue to believe It while not wanting to embarrass their “prophet” (Kiko) by denying It, it had to take the guts of a “theology professor” (Fr Angelo Veraldi) to come out and say it clearly – “Jesus is a sinner” and therefore He cannot be God! (I wonder if his syllogism went something like this – ‘All men are sinners; Jesus is a man; therefore Jesus is a sinner!’ Any logic student will quickly see the faulty premises; thus the faulty conclusion!)

    Furthermore, as St. Paul wrote in Hebrews 4:15 – “For we have not a high priest who cannot have compassion on our infirmities: but one who, tempted in all things like we are – but without sin.” Or another version I read “Christ became like us in all things, except sin.” The best exegesis I have read of Hebrews 4:15 is from a writing titled “Gifts Exposition of the Entire Bible” which read “… there was no sin in His nature; though He was encompassed about with infirmities, yet not with sinful infirmities, only sinless ones; nor was there any sin in His temptations; though He was solicited to sin by Satan, yet he (Satan) could find none in Him to work upon; nor could he (Satan) draw Him into the commission of any sin.” (Temptation on the Mount).

    Thank you for your very thorough research, Chuck. I hope that my attempt to add a little nuance to it is not a feeble attempt. – Joe R. San Agustin, Toto, GU. (7/23/2015)

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  3. It just gets better and better and better with these SCANDALS! Yet, my faith is reaffirmed in Jesus who is God to me! And I'm so very elated with joy and courage at the laity' responses and commands to these heresy's being promoted by Apuron. I'm still waiting for the biggest scandal yet! Expect more my friends!

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    1. The Catholic Church has MAJOR housecleaning to do my friend. We will do what we can here by exposing the wolves in sheep's clothing.

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    2. Dear Felix, this is true - the problems of the Church in the present age do not begin and end with the NCW on Guam. However, what happens with the NCW on Guam should not be underestimated in terms of its effect on the worldwide Church. The NCW on Guam is like the fruit of the fungi that sits beneath the surface, a rot that set in some decades ago, and which now, given an opportunity, has burst into view. I know personally that there are other Dioceses, Bishops and priests watching with some keen interest on this situation.

      Deus protector noster.

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  4. After I heard about this, I forbade my children from going to masses in churches where the celebrant is a neo presbyter..., they may go and pay their respect to the dead (rosary). or novenas, but don't stay for the masses. and to try to get their children to "Escuelan Pale some place else or teach them at home. jesofchalanpago

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    1. Here you are generalizing all priest the practice from the RMS.

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    2. This was a teacher, a professor, an instructor, invited here to instruct our deacon and priest candidates. He was teaching a class not just speaking off the cuff.

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    3. The real problem is not the heretic priest. The real problem is Apuron who permitted him to teach here, then pretends he doesn't know and only calls this huge heresy "bad theology"..

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  5. Just came from the CCOG meeting in Agat and every time I attend the meetings I come away with something new. This time Mr. Zoltan, (a Neo) was there, which made the evening more interesting. However i digress, so Tim talked about the Archbishops' KOLG "interview" which occurred June 2014, among many other topics. When I got home I searched for the link and everything started falling into place again. The transcript is quite lengthy but the gist of it all is that the Archbishop believes the NCW is the "fullness of the Catholic Faith" and that he wants all of us to "experience" it. Which means he wants all of us to be Neo!! Fellow "regular Catholics", wake up!!! Hitler took over Germany because too many good people were reluctant to speak up!! Don't let Guam's heritage and Catholic customs and traditions fall away because you want to stand on the side lines. Get involved, now!! Mr. Zoltan called the things presented at the CCOG meeting "superstitions". That is what he and his fellow Neo leaders think about what we do as Catholics on this island. Once again we have a foreigner telling us what to do and we have an Archbishop and two leaders more than willing to sell us out. One of the ladies talked about how the Santa Ana Chapel was taken away from her, her family and others in the parish, after they did all the fundraising to build that chapel. The Santa Ana Chapel is almost an exclusive Neo clubhouse. Once again, step up or as we have seen we are going to be stepped on!!

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    1. Mr. Santos, I totally agree! For you NEOCRAT Leaders who think you can manipulate our people, you're on for a long fight. You will come and go! We will remain here to protect our traditions!

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    2. The Neocatechumenal Way may have started out as a way of deepening one's faith, studying scripture, evangelizing around the world, etc., but it has changed to the point of being THE WAY. What does that make us who don't walk "the way"? Lost sheep? Lost souls on the wrong path? Following the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church isn't enough? We must also follow a few people who have found or re-dicovered THE WAY? No thanks. I'll take my chances with the traditional Catholic Church. If I end up somewhere other than heaven, so be it. I probably won't be alone.

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    3. Well said Andrew.NCW were sweet when they came for their intention was to slowly take over our church and our island. This they have done. It is our role now to remove those who have caused the damage to this community.

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    4. KIKO showed his true self when he said that single women play a vital role in their missions as they are used like "mullets" to attract men. The NCW act "sweet" when recruiting but their systematic indoctrination preps them for absolute obedience even when emotionally and verbally abused by catechist. Pius can back this up.

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  6. do neocats recite the nicene creed in their liturgy?

    also, the Holy Trinity is very much emphasized in the byzantine liturgy of st john chrysostom. maybe that's because of those early councils which were held in the east, which sorted out the trinitarian dogmas. they make the Sign of the Cross much more often than in the roman rite. they have special 3-branched candles (trinitarian) and 2-branched candles (dual nature of Christ). in the Divine Liturgy, you can't miss the emphasis on Trinity and Christ's divine and human natures.

    so, kiko's removal of trinitarian symbols from eastern iconography can only be deliberate. i'm convinced that he's not doing it to make the trinity more understandable to neocats, but to push his own erroneous teaching. the whole point of the icons is to help people pray with all those mysteries in mind, so removing the trinitarian symbolism is nothing less than teaching something other than orthodox Christianity.

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    1. A fundamental aspect of Kiko's philosophy/methodology is the necessity for a certain "existential moment". The symbolism, the actions (eg the scrutinies), the language, the theology, the role of the community are all designed to induce in the participant a moment where they are to experience the same existential grief that he claims to have experienced - and that he seems to believe is essential if one is to be considered Christian like him.

      So, it is reasonable then , and in fact necessary, in Kiko's understanding that the "ideal Man" - Jesus Christ, should also have experienced this existential moment. But for Kiko, the existential moment consists in the realization of one's own sinfulness (slavery in Egypt), and therefore it would be quite impossible for Christ to not share this same experience.

      Of course, anyone with any sense and particularly those with any interest in the lives of the saints will know that one does not need to induce an existential moment - life itself, replete with its joys and sufferings, is the existential moment. And nothing of existence can be made whole or satisfactorily resolved without the graces won for us on Calvary by the sacrifice of Our Dear Lord Jesus Christ, with and through and in which we unite with the Trinity in the Mass.

      Kiko's strategy has another purpose however, being to break down the man, so he can be remade in his own image - firstly by the certain experience (what Kiko and the Noes call "concrete events"), then by the uniformity of culture, symbolism and praxis. It is the antithesis of Catholicism and, by its very intention, a type of slavery itself.

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  7. Janet B - MangilaoJuly 24, 2015 at 9:38 AM

    Tony shows his true colors! Again, Tony displays his cowardice and complete lack of leadership with amazing aplomb. When asked a question about the kiko theology as taught by a kiko presbyter, the first thing Tony does is to deflect to someone else. Tony attempts to show how FD has bad theology by giving an example of a supposed FD student who answered that Jesus was a sinner. The question about the errant presbyter has nothing to do with FD or Catholic schools, but (good old defender of the kiko-faith) Tony decides to take a shot at his own Catholic schools. What an IDIOT...he is the leader of Catholic schools. Good job, Tony, you have pissed off a lot of FD alumni by trying to put your own school in a bad light, rather than answer a question about a kiko-presbyter heretic.

    What Tony forgot to consider in his inane example is that students, when asked questions by the Archbishop, often freeze up and cannot think straight, even if they know the answer. We have all seen this happen when Tony puts kids on the spot during Confirmation masses, in front of families and friends, and peers. It is a disgusting practice that he sadistically carries out to show his intimidating authority. But guess what. Even Tony gets flustered when put on the spot and asked questions in front of the world. Perhaps this is why so many people relish the picture of him squirming to avoid an answer, because we have seen him do exactly the same to innocent youth.

    I am certain if I asked this student in private if Jesus was a sinner the student would confidently respond "No Way!" Well, Tony, thanks for trashing the entire FD community. Most likely, the example is made up and not real. That's just Tony's style, a style we have seen so often.

    Now back to the real question: why did a kiko-presbyter say that Jesus was a sinner? This is a supposed priest, in the act of presenting a prepared lesson plan. It is not a frightened student put in the public spot light. Why would Fr Angelo teach this? We all know this is as wrong as wrong can be, right? Well, maybe not. Obviously, this kiko trained presbyter thought it was true. And I posit that Tony and Adrian also think it is true. Why do I draw this conclusion?

    This teaching took place in a class for deacon candidates, which Adrian is responsible for. When this comment was first made it caused quite a stir with the men studying for the deaconate. They questioned Adrian. If he thought this teaching was problematic he surely would have brought this heretical incident to the attention of Tony. Tony would then have taken steps to immediately clarify the issue to the deacon students. That’s what he did to the supposed FD students in the earlier example. But Tony did not. So no one at the Chancery did anything to get rid of this heretic presbyter or correct his teaching. They did nothing because they think the teaching correct. Hmmm…….

    to be continued...

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  8. Janet B - MangilaoJuly 24, 2015 at 9:38 AM

    continuation...

    There is one other possibility, which is a possibility more likely than the idiots on the hill believing Jesus was a sinner. Most likely is that they realized it was heresy, but since the teacher was a kiko they did nothing to correct him. We have seen this so many times. Fabio hides statues. Egivaldo teaches that girls are like sweet oranges to be sucked by boys. Luis sucks the sweet juice from girls. John Wadeson has a dark cloud of sex abuse hanging over his head. Jose Alberto mismanages donated funds. But our shepherd does nothing to father them and correct them. They continue to ruin the faith without consequence.

    But woe to a non-kiko, true priest. When an opportunity arises Tony abuses them. If no opportunity arises, charges are trumped up to persecute them. Just like the supposed FD student, they are put in the spotlight and shot in front of the public. If you are a kiko presbyter you can do no wrong, if you are a Catholic priest you can do no right. We, the people of God on Guam, are tired of this belittlement of our diocesan priests, and the exultation of the kiko-presbyter wanna-bes.

    And finally, when asked a question, Tony falls back to the comfortable fail-safe...LIE! [They will never know if I lie, Tony thinks] "Honestly I’d like to know who that priest is..." Come on Tony, you've known all along who that presbyter is, don't you. Why not just be honest and say that you've spoken to that presbyter about this grievous error, and what action you've taken to make sure our local men are properly trained? It would have been so easy to just be honest. After all, it wasn't you who made the mistake. Oh, but it was a kiko, so you felt compelled to defend at any cost. Ok. We get it. Kiko presbyter good, Catholic priest bad. Just be honest now and admit at least that.

    But not to worry, we will not hold our breath because we know the truth will continue to elude you. Thanks for once again showing your true colors.

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  9. Janet B - MangilaoJuly 24, 2015 at 9:54 AM

    I finally got my dinosaur pc to open Chuck's piece. I recall having read it before, but once again praise Mr White for his excellent critique of kiko's catechesis. Well researched, and well explained so common lay folks can see and understand. Too bad he will never be invited to teach at RMS. He is a talented defender of the faith. Thanks Chuck!

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  10. St. Athanasius, OPN.

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  11. This is for the person who left the comment with the objection about the instruction of a priest to "Bless the Lord." Certainly God does not need our blessing, but "bless" can also mean "honor" or "glorify":

    bless (blĕs)
    tr.v. blessed or blest (blĕst), bless·ing, bless·es
    1. To make holy by religious rite; sanctify: The clergy blessed the site for the new monastery.
    2. To invoke divine favor upon: The bishop blessed the fishing fleet.
    3. To make the sign of the cross over: She knelt and blessed herself.
    4. To honor as holy; glorify: Bless the Lord.
    5. To confer well-being or prosperity on: They were blessed with a baby girl.
    6. To endow, as with talent: He was blessed with a photographic memory.

    And this is how David uses it in Psalm 103: "Bless the LORD, O my soul: and all that is within me, bless his holy name."

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    1. When a presbyter says "Bless the Lord" I can't help but wonder what he means. LOL

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    2. An example of this would be after the benediction of the blessed Sacrament, and before resposing the Blessed Sacrament, It is customary for Catholics to recite the divine blessings acclamation. An offer of praise and Honor to our Lord.

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  12. @Tim, thank you for your clarification of the word "bless." In hindsight, I should have explained further what was said in its entirety. I understand and acknowledge the many uses of the word. The problem I had was in the context that it was used that morning at mass. As I stated before, it is painful to sit and listen to Fr. Michael's rambling from the pulpit as he has disjointed statements, fleeting thoughts. Anyhow, it's done...over! And still I shake my head and pray harder. Thanks again for taking the time to school me :)

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    1. Stop going to Mass there...or at least to the one he does.

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  13. Janet B - MangilaoJuly 24, 2015 at 5:03 PM

    I thoroughly agree with Tim. Anyone who goes to a mass presided by Fr Michael Jucutan risks brain damage. You should not go unless you want to hurt your spirit. The same applies to Tony's masses, and any kiko presbyter, its just that Fr Michael is more pathetic. Poor guy. I don't blame him, he didn't have a chance at proper formation. Too bad he opted for "Jesus was a sinner" as his formation model.
    Pray for them. We are stuck with them all, even when Tony leaves, so they need a whole lotta prayers. Maybe a more benevolent bishop will scoop them up when Tony is ordered to march.
    We can pray for that, maybe.

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  14. The NEO Cult Presbyters need to be scooped out of the Island of Guam.....We don;t need these serpents who can't walk the walk and talk the talk. Just slither back to the hell hole the came from....it will bring back the paradise that was here before this cancerous infestation.

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  15. Diana blog real hate blog. Shame on you Adrian.

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  16. Paragraph 234 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church reminds us “The mystery of the Most Holy Trinity is the central mystery of Christian faith and life.It is the mystery of God himself. It is therefore the source of all the other mysteries of faith. The light that enlightens them. It is the most fundamental and essential teaching in the hierarchy of the truths of faith.”

    This is no miniscule point to emphasize, It means that if the NCW doctrine missed the point about who God is, Their entire doctrine is skewed. It also means that their concept of who they are or who man is also skewed also since our origin is God himself, after whose image and likeness we are created after.

    Why is it that the NCW membership places so much emphasis on what Kiko and Carmen Teaches? Dont they realize that it will never par with the Church that Jesus Christ founded. Schipture tells us that this Church, and no one else "Is the pillar and Foundation of Truth.(1Tim 3:15)

    Brothers and Sisters, We should continue to oppose this heretical teaching. And in Charity pray also for God to open their eyes to his truth.
    God Bless

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